Advice Needed Please!

[Xenon]

Hi Everyone:

I have decided that 2007 is going to be my audio year for my car. I am hoping to have the first phase of my audio done by March. But I am nowhere close to an audio expert when it comes to Car Audio Components, as a matter of fact, I'd say I'm pretty much a novice when it comes to it. So I thought I would seek advice on the forums.

What kind of audio system I'm looking for:
- CLEAR Audio. Bass is important, but not as much as clarity. My audio system should be clear and rich in not only bass, but mids and highs as well. Although I am a trance person, clarity is more important than bass.
-Bang-for-buck quality. Don't mistake this for cheap. But I also don't want to pay an excessive amount for the audio components if I don't have to.
- This system will be built for sound. Video isn't going to be considered.

My phases:
Phase 1 - Deck, Satellite Radio, iPod hook Up.
Phase 2 - Steering Wheel Controls, Amp, Woofer
Phase 3 - Full speaker swap with any additional final touches required.

What kind of advice I'm seeking:
Review and comparisons more than anything. Approximate price points for quality components and recommendations for installers, as I don't feel confident in installing these components myself.

-----------------------------------

So first off, Phase 1.
THE DECK - I have already found a deck I want. My brother has had excellent experience with Pioneer, and I am going to follow his advice. I have decided on the Pioneer DEH-P6800MP (http://www.pioneerelectronics.ca/pna/product/detail/0,,32171715_32249679_301762035,00.html) Deck. I can get it for approximately $200 USD including taxes and shipping. All I'm asking is if anyone has had any good or bad experiences with Pioneer decks. and whether $200 USD shipped is a decent price.

THE AMP - Here is where I am clueless. If someone could explain to me the difference between a 1-channel, 2-channel and multi-channel amp, that would be most appreciated. In addition to that, what features should I be looking for in an Amp? Considering that it will eventually be connected to not only the deck and woofer, but 4 speakers and 2 tweeters as well. What brands are most reliable and have the highest quality? How much money am I looking at for a good amp? Again, user reviews and suggestions are most appreciated.

THE SUBWOOFER - I don't want ultra-heavy bass, but I want a kick to it. So I decided that a 10" woofer will be sufficient for my needs. Thusfar, just based on price, I am looking at a Rockford Fosgate P310D4 Punch 10" (http://www.bestbuy.ca/catalog/proddetail.asp?sku_id=0926INGFS10042306&catid=20118&logon=&langid=EN) subwoofer. I am also looking into Pioneer, Clarion and Infinity. But I would also like to know what is a good wattage rating for a woofer and what are other things to consider when purchasing a subwoofer? Similar approach as the amp, which brands are highest quality and most reliable? Reviews very welcome!

INSTALLATION - Where have other members gone for installation? Recommendations?

I know this is a lot, but I want to educate myself before doing anything. I want to thank in advance anyone who replies to this post. Your input is valued and most appreciated.

Cheers,
Lawrence

[b]

Hi Everyone:

So first off, Phase 1.
THE DECK - I have already found a deck I want. My brother has had excellent experience with Pioneer, and I am going to follow his advice. I have decided on the Pioneer DEH-P6800MP (http://www.pioneerelectronics.ca/pna/product/detail/0,,32171715_32249679_301762035,00.html) Deck. I can get it for approximately $200 USD including taxes and shipping. All I'm asking is if anyone has had any good or bad experiences with Pioneer decks. and whether $200 USD shipped is a decent price.

Your deck is on sale @ futureshop for $260 + tax. It will be a few bucks more than where you have priced out but you get 30 day no issue return policy. It came in handy when my deck died on me (somehow after my engine was replaced my deck wasn't working)

http://www.futureshop.ca/catalog/proddetail.asp?logon=&langid=EN&MSCSProfile=3C79F0C7EA3162B2F4DE0859C8631BEA37A9ED 456AB284F25D52CA7AA67ED23E22A7476547CF57DF059CD675 C2FC3368EB766ED92D4E0DDF67414D159779CC452D75899069 7ADBA2ED521885C307F30B038FDF982FDF95659B17C32B3E45 6143C8750C1530243775F04AEF581E418B97BEF030E08B0497 0E&sku_id=0665000FS10071355&catid=10174

The deck is $320 @ best buy. If you go to best buy and show them that it is $260 at futureshop... best buy will beat the price and give you an extra 10% of the difference off! You could walk away with this deck for almost the same price you could get it in the states for. Plus you'd have the ease of returning it to any canadain best buy if you change your mind within 30 days. Say you don't like the display etc...

Sale ends @ futureshop on 01/01/07 so you'd have to buy it at best buy tomorrow to get the bonus 10% of the difference off.


THE AMP - Here is where I am clueless. If someone could explain to me the difference between a 1-channel, 2-channel and multi-channel amp, that would be most appreciated. In addition to that, what features should I be looking for in an Amp? Considering that it will eventually be connected to not only the deck and woofer, but 4 speakers and 2 tweeters as well. What brands are most reliable and have the highest quality? How much money am I looking at for a good amp? Again, user reviews and suggestions are most appreciated.

I don't know much about amp's but I have a sony xplod amp. Have had it for 4 years. Pulled it out of my old car. It is red & looks nice ha ha ha. Jokes aside. I think it is 250 watt but I have to go look at it tomorrow again. It has way more juice than I need. I am running a jvc deck & a 12" pioneer sub. I have my gains @ or below 1/2. If I cranked up the bass/sub & all the gains it would be disgusting bass. I prefer good all around sound. I have cranked it all before and sounds very crisp and clear.


THE SUBWOOFER - I don't want ultra-heavy bass, but I want a kick to it. So I decided that a 10" woofer will be sufficient for my needs. Thusfar, just based on price, I am looking at a Rockford Fosgate P310D4 Punch 10" (http://www.bestbuy.ca/catalog/proddetail.asp?sku_id=0926INGFS10042306&catid=20118&logon=&langid=EN) subwoofer. I am also looking into Pioneer, Clarion and Infinity. But I would also like to know what is a good wattage rating for a woofer and what are other things to consider when purchasing a subwoofer? Similar approach as the amp, which brands are highest quality and most reliable? Reviews very welcome!

You can't go wrong with a Rockford Fosgate sub. BTW a guy I used to chum with his dad was the ontario service/sales rep for Rockford & he lives in Burlington. He did most of the warranty work on subs that were sent in for repair. His garage was full of supplies to rip apart subs and rebuild from the ground up. I haven't talked to the guy in like 7 years but back then we used to get free rebuilt subs. So to make it a short story... If you have issues. It is local to get them fixed. I sold my Rockford sub's for $250 and bought the cheaper 12" pioneer sub for $100 bucks. Sounds really good but it isn't in the league of the RF's.

AB

[b]

P.S. I will dig up my reciepts for your PM tomorrow morning it'll make too much noise to check tonight.

P.S. Here is the link to the best buy customer service price protection.

http://www.bestbuy.ca/helpsection/EN/online_policies.asp?onlinepoliciesID=1&logon=&langid=EN&MSCSProfile=3C79F0C7EA3162B26C5CAD785174A5AA5A80D7 F0E40DE97ED7691A9DF237BB02A798A3D92DBE9932559F7353 08E0C17E2BE819E9D678D170C67077D586496A31249DA8BB0F 87DEF99318653035D08D8A81EE2DB19F6E8DE17B794C1CCEB7 F565C1B09C5D0DA2E2964BDA8DE0FBC60738BA69C79BF71093 DB

[Xenon]

Your deck is on sale @ futureshop for $260 + tax. It will be a few bucks more than where you have priced out but you get 30 day no issue return policy. It came in handy when my deck died on me (somehow after my engine was replaced my deck wasn't working)

http://www.futureshop.ca/catalog/proddetail.asp?logon=&langid=EN&MSCSProfile=3C79F0C7EA3162B2F4DE0859C8631BEA37A9ED 456AB284F25D52CA7AA67ED23E22A7476547CF57DF059CD675 C2FC3368EB766ED92D4E0DDF67414D159779CC452D75899069 7ADBA2ED521885C307F30B038FDF982FDF95659B17C32B3E45 6143C8750C1530243775F04AEF581E418B97BEF030E08B0497 0E&sku_id=0665000FS10071355&catid=10174

The deck is $320 @ best buy. If you go to best buy and show them that it is $260 at futureshop... best buy will beat the price and give you an extra 10% of the difference off! You could walk away with this deck for almost the same price you could get it in the states for. Plus you'd have the ease of returning it to any canadain best buy if you change your mind within 30 days. Say you don't like the display etc...

Sale ends @ futureshop on 01/01/07 so you'd have to buy it at best buy tomorrow to get the bonus 10% of the difference off.


I'd get the deck in Canada by jan 1st, but I'm in Florida right now :P

[skunk2]

a 1 channel amp or monoblock amp is used for substage duties.typically high powered and current hungry.
a 2 channel can be used for your front stage or this can be bridged to power a sub. your multi channel is like an all purpose amp, can be used to power the fronts and a sub or just power 4 door speakers.
are you going to be running 1 or 2 amps? how much room are you willing to sacrifice in the back for the enclosure?
for a simpler application get a 4 channel amp, smaller footprint, and replace the stock fronts with a decent set of components and since you want to run a 10" sub the rear channels of the amp can be bridged for this. my elemental designs 9.4 amp is running my fronts which is an elemental designs 6000s and a 12 inch ed EHQS sub with no issues. i dont run rear fill. the fronts produce clear sound with plenty of bass. i've tried the fronts before without an amp just running off the deck and they sounded great. if you want to listen to this set up just let me know.

[MPS]

stay away from Pioneer decks they suck preout 2 volt ... try getting Alpine 5 volt out

http://www.alpine-usa.com/en/products/product.php?model=CDA-9857

http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZontrakphilQQhtZ-1

subs rockford fosgate bad move you want clean sound go with Eclipse ... if you want longer bass get 12' short bass 10'

http://www.eclipse-web.com/sw7000/sw7200.html



as far as amps i find JL audio the best for the $$$ 500/1 mono block 1ch

http://mobile.jlaudio.com/products_amps.php?amp_id=252

http://cgi.ebay.com/JL-Audio-500-1-Monoblock-Class-D-Amplifier-NIB_W0QQitemZ330068784473QQihZ014QQcategoryZ18796Q QrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem


im sure you know the setup i had it was clean so if you need help Lawrence call me any time .....

[azn_outlaw]

Rock the Alpine deck...always loved them...I used to own one myself and actaully the cleanest sounding deck you can find on the market...

Pioneer I never really liked, oddly enough....even though..
considered lower but IMO a higher value and better quality, i prefer Clarion Decks then Pioneer..

And subs and speakers, I prefer Diamond Audio....

if you got a budget in mind to spend PM me....I can help u out as much as I can, or just direct u to the shop that has helped me through the years....

wait you know the Mazda3 in side and out....since you can take apart the whole car, I can be right beside you and teach you how to install everything, its not hard just time consuming....I think even Juan aka CoolColumbian can help as well.

[Broli]

i also am a fan of alpine decks, sound quality is pretty good, and you can setup everything you need to and fine tune it very nicely,

i personally like RF subs, you aren't going for a mind blowing knock-em dead bass, so one RF sub will do good for you, i would go with a 12, one 12 in a sealed box wont take up that much room.

i agree with vlad on the JL amps, all JL stuff is good but pricey

good luck with this Lawerence, i look forward to seeing what you do!

[Xenon]

OK... I am hearing that a lot of people don't like the Pioneer Deck, but here's the thing. i want an OLED Matrix display. Something that can have a screensaver and can display some cool graphics or something. From the Alpine ones i'm seeing on the Alpine Website (http://www.alpine-usa.com/en/products/series.php?category=AV_HU) I'm not seeing any that have this feature. In addition to that, The head units are totally out of my price range. MSRP starts at $269 and it doesn't even have half the features I want on it.

I'm looking for a deck that has:
-Mono-colour (but changable) display that can display graphics and a screensaver
-iPod expandability
-Sirius Satellite Radio expandability
- CD/MP3 Playback

The Pioneer player has all of that, at a price where Alpine just starts out. That is why it caught my attention.

[MPS]

try Kenwood ... i still find them better then Pioneer ..... the only reason i had Pioneer and will have again is cus of the Navi

http://www.kenwood.ca/products/ListCateg.aspx?k1=2&k2=46&k3=172

[MPS]

this unit looks sweet .... and i know where to get good deal on this stuff

http://www.kenwood.ca/products/ListProduct.aspx?k1=2&k2=46&k3=172&pr=2356

[Xenon]

That deck looks good. The price is still higher than what I want to spend on a deck tho. It's still $300 USD + shipping, which is $100 USD more than I wanted to pay.

How good of a deal are we talking? Because honestly $250 USD (~$290 CDN), shipped is as much as I want to pay for a deck.

I think you may be overestimating how much i want to spend on the deck. Like I said, I don't want cheap, but I'm not looking at high-end equipment either. The Alpine decks were as much as I wanted to spend on the Deck and Amp together and then some. For Deck, Amp and Sub I don't really want to go over $700. I'm lookking for an upgrade to the stock system, not something that blows my windows out.

[b]

I bought this one a few months back:

http://www.bestbuy.ca/catalog/proddetail.asp?logon=&langid=EN&sku_id=0926INGFS10071823&catid=21981#

At first when I thought of JVC I thought of the wost products made. A friend told me to suck it up and try it out. It works well. I am very happy with it. I didn't want anything super high budget either.

http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k233/blackman99/newdeck_02.jpg

http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k233/blackman99/newdeck_01.jpg

[queens49]

Hey Xenon,
For speakers and amps, you should take a look at Kaption Audio. Last year they moved their head office to the building right across the parking lot from where I work. I had never heard of them before, but I decided to check them out. I'm upgrading the audio system slowly, and I started w/ their 5x7 Axial HD series speakers just to try them out, and I am really happy with them. I got the set on sale for ~$130+tax. While I was there, they had the High Output 4-channel amp on sale for ~$250+tax. I had brought my friend who is into audio as well, and we both agree that the Kaption setup they had in the store was amazing, the sound was crisp, and clear. When I finally get time, I'm planning on getting the component speakers from them and moving the existing 5x7 speakers to the back, and installing the components in the front.
Kaption Audio is a Canadian company, so it's always nice to support local companies...

[MPS]

i had Kaption for 2 years now yes they are sweet and the top of the line is alot of cash like the MPT


Hey Xenon,
For speakers and amps, you should take a look at Kaption Audio. Last year they moved their head office to the building right across the parking lot from where I work. I had never heard of them before, but I decided to check them out. I'm upgrading the audio system slowly, and I started w/ their 5x7 Axial HD series speakers just to try them out, and I am really happy with them. I got the set on sale for ~$130+tax. While I was there, they had the High Output 4-channel amp on sale for ~$250+tax. I had brought my friend who is into audio as well, and we both agree that the Kaption setup they had in the store was amazing, the sound was crisp, and clear. When I finally get time, I'm planning on getting the component speakers from them and moving the existing 5x7 speakers to the back, and installing the components in the front.
Kaption Audio is a Canadian company, so it's always nice to support local companies...

[Broli]

a thing to think about lawerence is that the deck will be governing to some degree ur sound quality, u said u want very clean sound, which to me means that you need a good quality deck, if everything else is amazying and u go with a lesser quality deck u may not be happy with the sound.

[queens49]

Couldn't agree more. The source is an important part for sound quality...if the source is bad, the output is going to be bad, just amplified by the amp.


a thing to think about lawerence is that the deck will be governing to some degree ur sound quality, u said u want very clean sound, which to me means that you need a good quality deck, if everything else is amazying and u go with a lesser quality deck u may not be happy with the sound.

[TheProfessor]

So far I've owned head units made by Kenwood, Sony, Pioneer and Alpine. Of the bunch the Pioneer and Alpine were my two favorite, but in terms of features and sound quality it was no comparison, the Alpine was the best. Their decks are not so much about flash but rather sound quality and features.

If it were me, I'd skip the Pioneer with it's trendy display and opt for the Alpine.

Next up is your amp. You have to decide whether or not you want a multi-channel amp to power your entire system or simply your subwoofer. If you go with a good deck then you can save yourself some $$$ and just power your sub with the external amp. For this I would go with a decent class D amp. Again, Alpine has some pretty good units at reasonable prices. I personally have JL Audio amps but to be honest unless you're a stereo nut they're not worth the money. Some of the amps MTX offers are also pretty good, but again, I would stick with the Alpine if it were me.

With respect to subwoofers, have you decided what size of driver you want? Do you want to buy a sub and box together or the speaker on it's own and have a box custom made? If you go custom, and depending on how powerful your amp is, I would go with a sealed enclosure as it will yield the best sound quality. Choosing a subwoofer will be one of the most difficult decisions IMO as they're quite hard to properly audition and there is just such a huge variety to choose from out there. Figure out what you want to spend and I could help narrow it down a bit.

Speakers are also tricky in that there are a ton out there. Thankfully most reasonable shops have them hooked up so you can listen to them, quite possibly powered off of the deck you intend on purchasing. Keep in mind here that choice of speakers is largely dependent on how they sound to you and nothing else. Each brand has a unique sound, some will be appealing to you while others not so much. Kaption, as was mentioned above, is a top notch Canadian speaker manufacturer, but for your purposes they are overkill. High end speakers tend to shine only when being fed a healthy amount of power. If you're running them off of deck power it's better to stick to the more affordable 'usual' brands IMO like Alpine, Pioneer, Infinity, MTX, RF, etc.

Finally don't forget to budget at least an extra $100-150 for wiring and speaker mounting kits.

As for install, it's really not that difficult, but if you're uncomfortable there are a number of shops I trust who will charge a reasonable rate to do the install. To keep costs down you could install all the speakers yourself and leave the deck and amp install to the pros.

[Xenon]

The deck Mazdaspeed recommended (http://www.kenwood.ca/products/ListProduct.aspx?k1=2&k2=46&k3=172&pr=2356) has really caught my attention. I will probably be going with that.

I am still doing research for my amp, however, to answer TheProfessor's question, I will be wanting an amp that will eventually power the entire sound system. The only difference is that I'm going to be doing the audio in parts, not all at once. So I will buy an amp that can power the entire system, but for the first bit, it will just be powering the woofer.

I am looking for a 10" woofer. 12" is nice, but I don't need that much bass. I'm not sure about whether I want an enclosed or custom woofer. I have not reached that poitn in my research yet.

I have also decided to modify the process that I'm going to build the system:

DECK - Installed by End of March
AMP & WOOFER - Installed by End of June
**If sound quality is sufficient to my liking, the following will be done later than scheduled**
Front Speakers (Component) - Installed by end of October
Rear Speakers - Installed by end of December

There are two reasons why I want to build the system in that order:
1) I want to hear the sound quality diffference with each step.
2) Budget and Research - I will not buy a component until I'm sure I'm making the right choice.

[Broli]

if you buy everything a piece at a time you will end up spending more, shops are more willing to give you a discount if you buy more than one item, and no shop will take your word that you will come back next month for another item.

maybe do it in two purchase sections? (1. deck sub amp and 2. speakers front and back) you can still install things one at a time if you are going to do it yourself, but if you go piece by piece for purchase and have each component instaled professionaly . . . you are really upping your costs IMO

[Xenon]

Deck, Satellite Radio and ipod hookup installed!

http://www.torontomazda3.ca/forum/showthread.php?p=147195

[TheProfessor]

Looks good, glad you went with the Alpine unit.

[Operator]

For good SQ subs look at JL Audio, Fi Audio, ID Max, Sound Splinter, and Elemental designs. All have nice bass output but have lines tailored for SQ. Once you find your sub it's easier to pick out an amp.

[Xenon]

I was looking at either a JL Woofer or a Rockford Fosgate.... not sure where I'm going to go for amps yet. I'll probably want a multi channel amp, so that I can have just one amp powering the woofer and speakers. But I'm not sure of that yet. I still have to think about it

[royroy]

I was looking at either a JL Woofer or a Rockford Fosgate.... not sure where I'm going to go for amps yet. I'll probably want a multi channel amp, so that I can have just one amp powering the woofer and speakers. But I'm not sure of that yet. I still have to think about it
well... it really depends on how much money u really wanna spend on it... ... but i think u will like something small..maybe a JL 10w3...
as for amps... it is REALLY expensive to get a multi channel amp....the guy that installed my sub said it is better to have 2 different amps.. 1 for woofer.. 1 multi channel for speakers... and brand makes a different...."what you pay is what you get" (thats wt i hear from vlad all the time) =P

and you can put the amps inside the tray so everything is clean..

[MPS]

you may want to check out JL 500/5 its about $700 but you know i can always work around that

[Flagrum_3]

^^^ I believe a couple of members here got the 500/5 amp at G&G electronics, which is probably the best place for JL equipment (cost-wise).I can't remember what they paid though.Maybe they can chime in if they read this.
I personally went the 2 amp route, 1 -4 channel and 1 mono both by Rockford Fosgate with the JL 10W6v2 ProWedge and JL components....as far as SQ goes, ...the combo would be hard to beat without spending a shitload more money.


_3


.

[royroy]

^^^ I believe a couple of members here got the 500/5 amp at G&G electronics, which is probably the best place for JL equipment (cost-wise).I can't remember what they paid though.Maybe they can chime in if they read this.
I personally went the 2 amp route, 1 -4 channel and 1 mono both by Rockford Fosgate with the JL 10W6v2 ProWedge and JL components....as far as SQ goes, ...the combo would be hard to beat without spending a shitload more money.


_3


.
wt speakers do u have?? coze i m gonna look for them soon... and i have the same sub as u..=P

[Flagrum_3]

I got the JL VR650csi components, thier not the best they have but I got them because of the the silk dome tweeter....for softer highs.


_3


.

[TheProfessor]

I have two 500/5's and I can tell you that for the money you'd be hard pressed to find a better amp. Having said that, I would never, ever pay even close to retail. G&G would likely charge closer to $1000 for the amp after tax and for that I wouldn't do it. I managed to pick up both of mine in gently used condition.....one for about $500 and the other for $450.

[Operator]

I went the 2 amp route. With the 450/4 and the 1000/1. For my purposes it was an ideal setup. Though Xenon, depending on his setup might do well with the 300/4 and the 500/1.