Track Day for Toronto Mazda 3 Anyone???

[davidpetrozza]

Hey Guys,

I just wanted to make a suggestion to everyone in the forum that maybe we should have a TM3 track day at one of one of our many surrounding tracks around the GTA. I think it would be cool to have a bunch of us drive out to Mosport or Shannonville and put our rides to the ultimate test. I know everyone is worried about tire wear or breaking something, be we can set it up so that we have seperate sessions on the track: for advanced to rookie drivers. I think it would just be fun for TM3 to get out on the track and show our mazda pride.

It's just a thought!

[Fuman]

I tried last season. one member came to the Track Event hosted by hondaprelude.to/Ian Law's Racing School.
If people are interested:
Mosport DDT (NOT BIG track) is a good track since its not a power track.
Don't go to Shannonville (IF this becomes our first official track event), its too far. Not to mention the difference between between the mazda 3 and speed3 will become very obvious. Won't be much fun for regular Mazda 3 owners to be repeated lapped by speed 3s.
Anyway, good luck with this. I'll PM you when the hondaprelude.to track even comes around since you are into this sort of stuff.

[mazda lover]

Can I bring my 1969 Z28 Camaro, bring it on...
Great idea but I am out...

[davidpetrozza]

I have raced karts at a high level for the past couple of years, and I would love to see what my car would be able to do. I agree that the big track configurations would be discouraging for the regular Mazda 3 owners. The MS3 would tear us apart. The DDT track would deffinitely be a great track to have this event on. I race my kart there every year. It's not so much about the speed, but rather the skill of the driver. Plus, it's not that big for those of you intimidated by these big race car tracks. One of TM3's event organizers should really look into this.

[Fuman]

I have raced karts at a high level for the past couple of years, and I would love to see what my car would be able to do. I agree that the big track configurations would be discouraging for the regular Mazda 3 owners. The MS3 would tear us apart. The DDT track would deffinitely be a great track to have this event on. I race my kart there every year. It's not so much about the speed, but rather the skill of the driver. Plus, it's not that big for those of you intimidated by these big race car tracks. One of TM3's event organizers should really look into this.
Its hard.
We have to pay the track fee up front then collect money from the members.
And if NOT enough members go TM3 has to pay for the rest of it.
Can a mod please add a poll to this thread for interest in track event in 2008
edit: Thanks Mods
Our cars can do reasonable well at DDT.
Thread from my last season. (just click on the video links)
http://www.torontomazda3.ca/forum/showthread.php?t=21494

[davidpetrozza]

Hey Fuman,

that was an awesome vid. Looks like you guys had a lot of fun!

[Fuman]

Hey Fuman,

that was an awesome vid. Looks like you guys had a lot of fun!
yeah =) Met a lot of cool people. The Good drivers never told us how much I sucked or anything, just told me what to improve on and such. Real nice people.
We need at least 30 interested before we can really get going with this?
(Assuming 5 drop out. 25 is a good # for DDT).
Will the Admins be cool, if we invited other car clubs?

[mleblond]

I would try to keep it TM3 and see what kind of turnout you come up with.

I personally never been on a track before but would love to start some day. (May want to take up a class if I can find one)(and find myself a funny helmet:chuckle)

We could probably have spectators and maybe organize more than just the track for that day. Bring BBQ's, volleyball nets, whatever...

[davidpetrozza]

Yea deffinitely! This could be a realy cool event!

[davidpetrozza]

We need some admins to get involved.

[azn_outlaw]

here is one idea...

list all tracks avaliable and how far each one is....

I wouldnt mind giving this a try, sure would be a little more fun then auto-x

[Fuman]

here is one idea...

list all tracks avaliable and how far each one is....

I wouldnt mind giving this a try, sure would be a little more fun then auto-x
Most people have said auto-x is more fun. But you only get a few runs in auto-x.
Any where drivable and fun is likely Shannonville (2 hr drive one way) & DDT (1HR from STC).
If you want to do school. Ian Law teaches at DDT, thats where I learned.
DDT is a good track for people to hone in on their mistakes.. Shannonville should be a track for 2009, when our members are more experienced (assuming most people haven't been to a track event before). The main reason I don't recommend Shannonville for out first season is because of distance and people on the way back from the event likely won't last a two hour drive.
hmmm...
Another fun track will is somewhere near Ottawa, forgot the name.
Can a mod, please add "Yes w/ track school" to the poll?

[BETRTHNU]

I'm in this year dude. Glad you had fun with my Prelude buddies. I'll be doing both next year if we can get people interested.

[RallyPlaya]

This seems like a real cool event i would be down as well. approximately how much will it cost if we get a group of 25 and i was watching the video you're not allowed to pass rite?

[mleblond]

There is probably a big list of rules for safety purposes...we should see if we can get that list somewhere...

[whiteomega]

they're probably general safety and common sense tips:

don't pass in corners
don't follow the car in front bumper-to-bumper
wear a helmet...
etc.

[Swerny]

I did a lapping day 2 years ago with some of my fellow Protege guys.

It was at Mosport DDT.

All i can say about it is....wow!

It was an absolute blast.

The day was put on by one of the Subaru Club guys, his screen name is Subarism.

I think the cost was $75 each or so.

He said the limit was 35 cars, but there were definitely more than that in the afternoon session.

In the morning we ran clockwise, in the afternoon counter-clockwise.

I would do it again for sure.

[Unoriginalusername]

maybe interested depending on time and price

[alhope34]

I'd probably go.

[Fuman]

Assuming we do this with Ian Law Racing School.
(Following are prices that ppl paid in 07 w/ Hondaprelude)
Pre-meet at 6:30. Leave Pre-meet location at 6:45am.
8am or 9am-5pm at DDT (forgot the start time). One hour-intervals between students and lappers. Students and lappers are on the track together at the last hour of the day
$160 for lappers
$260 for Students (<-- I think insurance is included with school).

Setup Costs:
Helmet: $100-150 (tax included)
Car prep: (Check your pads, tire tread, and your fluids. Make sure all fluids are relatively new).
The guys with Autos: To be on the safe side, make sure your transmission oil are newer than 10,000KM. Otherwise do a drain and fill. (Cost you around $70. If you buy the Oil at MOT and go to a shop).
Bleed the brakes a little and top off the brake fluid. (unless you did so recently).
Make sure all your signal/brake lights are working.
Proper tire pressure
Bring Engine oil if you know your car burns oil.
CHECK the amount of brake pad materials you have left
Non-clear tape to tape up your license plates <-- do this AT the track

Safety Rules:
Passing only on straights (these straights will be designated during the driver's meeting on track day).
The car that is LETTING people pass must be the one moving off the racing line. Signal or stick your hand out the window to let ppl know it is SAFE to pass).
Make sure your car is prepped.
1 warm-up lap
1 cool-down lap
NO loose objects in the car
Stick your hand out the window when going into pits (So the guy behind won't crash into you).
If you spin out and go off the track. Go the pits immediately to have your car inspected (JUST INCASE).

Money NOT to spend on (If you are a novice):
Racing Tires (R-compounds are stupid, if you are new at this. You won't be able to pull out the full potential of the car w/ stock tires).
Sway-bars (If you have Aftermarket sways installed. Practice your throttle control. Do not lift-off, you might spin out).
If you have RS-As and DO NOT LIKE THEM. Use them at the track. (Trust me on this one. Even if it rains, RS-As are pretty good on track. Better then General UHPs [at least at Shannonville])

Rules specific to students:
NO pass period until you graduate.


Thats all i can think off.
Feel free to add to the list. And if you disagree with what I said above,
feel free to say so.

Going at the beginning of May is a good idea.
Students don't have crazy school yet (As in University students and highschool). Weather isn't too hot.

[doughboyr6]

i've been to the DDT (or RDT as we called it, "R" for rider") several times. I love that track. Been to Mosport Big and 3 of the 4 configs at Shannonville (all on a bike). This is by far my favorite of them all, yes the surface is not the greatest, but the layout is super fun, and its not even intended for bikes really.

Depending on cost, i may be in. $160 seems steep, but if its exclusive to only about 25-30 people then i would anticipate quite a bit of track time, so thats not too bad.

Never driven on a track in a car, so i'd suck, and i can't even do heel/toe on the 3....the pedals aren't spaced right for my foot. But i think i'd give it a go just to say i've done it.

Track days i've been to (bikes) generally have 3 classes (newbies/intermediate/hot shoe) and the rules are as follows

newbies - passing only on straights.
intermediate - passing on straights and outside only
hot shoe - anywhere

this track is so narrow though, i wouldn't anticipate too much passing into the turns....unless ppl go balls out.

this is the only config i've ran at this track.

http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w107/doughboyr6/aerial_small.gif

the only other thing for the organizers of this, i'd love to see this happen, just keep in mind that everyone tends to say yes loudly over the board now....but when time comes, many may back out....so i'm not sure how accurate this poll will really be.

[doughboyr6]

has anyone looked into Cayuga also?

[RallyPlaya]

Well 160 Seems a bit over my budget, if TM3 can get a nice discount say 100 & Under im Still in. MS MPS Got to do this for 75$. Id be down in that price range. Seems like a great idea though

[doughboyr6]

the $160 i typed above was just going off of what Fuman wrote before....i may have misunderstood his meaning if that is the pricing if we merged our day with the school. Wait until someone actually crunches some #s before your make up your mind...

Typically speaking trackdays range from $100 (pretty darn cheap) - $180 (pretty darn expensive). The smaller tracks like this one should be on the lower end. And Mosport (big) would be on the upper end. When i did this track on a bike, i think it was $120/bike and lunch was included. There were 4 groups of about 15-20.

[Swerny]

Well 160 Seems a bit over my budget, if TM3 can get a nice discount say 100 & Under im Still in. MS MPS Got to do this for 75$. Id be down in that price range. Seems like a great idea though

I looked back for the thread and it was actually $100.

Keep in mind this didn't include any training or classes with Ian Law.

It was literally show up, prep your car, and drive.

Still well worth it.

[Swerny]

Oh, and it was for 5 hours with no break. We changed directions half way through the day.

[mEtH]

I would if I didn't just get rid of mine and new one wasn't so stock.


We need some admins to get involved.

[Fuman]

160 is from 9-5. (w/ about 25-30 cars on the track)
If we get more ppl (it'll be cheaper) and this price is assuming we are going with IRL.
If we don't I'm sure it'll be cheaper.

If you want something under 100.
That will not be 9-5.

Our rules should be to pass only if allowed and only on straights (for safety reasons).

Better map of DDT
http://www.race2000.com/images/course_map.gif
Video of how much power does NOT matter at DDT. Thats a mazda 3 with a bunch of S2000s.
http://www.hondaprelude.to/forums/showpost.php?p=1060622&postcount=113

What is everyone's budget for this event?

Is it that ppl don't think track school is worth it or is it juts out of their budget?

Ppl can go even if their Mazda 3 / speed 3 is complete stock (including autos), provided that you prepped your car.

updated car prep list (bolded this new entry)

[doughboyr6]

absolutely, power is useless cause you can't use it on such a small track. If my memory is right, i was only using up to 4th gear or 5th (at most) on a bike....the only part that is fast is coming out of 10 up the hill to 12.

I'm sure that map is accurate, but it feels so different when you're on the track. T8 seemed so much sharper....it almost felt like it hooked back more, and i didn't realize 4 was a 90 degree turn. It felt almost like esses (4/5)

[doughboyr6]

i think 10-4 would be a good window to work with and keep costs lower....still plenty of time. Curious, is there an ambulance crew on site during track days?

[Fuman]

i think 10-4 would be a good window to work with and keep costs lower....still plenty of time. Curious, is there an ambulance crew on site during track days?
lol, nope.
No one ever got hurt; no car accidents (Car failures don't count)
on all the track dates I've been to.

We just have to lay down strict rules, and plan ahead and we won't have issues either.

Going counter-clockwise: if you go past turn 11 and keep right. The unlabeled right turn is hard to judge the proper corner speed, it's also off camber =(

[doughboyr6]

i've only been clock wise....but it'd be fun i'm sure the other way too.

[Fuman]

i've only been clock wise....but it'd be fun i'm sure the other way too.
Clockwise is fun! I found counter to be a bit tricky because of how the course is, it is hard to see where the corner exits are when going counter.

[Fuman]

I'm gonna make a few assumptions:
1) No track School
2) TM3 does not have budget to pay in advance for track.

So I we should pay an admin up front (e.g. TheBiz) who will hang on to the money.
IF we have enough members going, we go.
If we don't, the admin can just give us back the money.
(I have NOT asked admins anything related to this issue. I want to see what you guys think before bugging them)

[RallyPlaya]

A Good idea could be to make a list of everyone seriously interested, also what date do you propose that we have the TM3 Race event.

[Fuman]

A Good idea could be to make a list of everyone seriously interested, also what date do you propose that we have the TM3 Race event.
I think it'll better to call it TM3 Track Day.
Very very beginning of May or End of August (University people are starting/ending school).
Beginning of May is best because of Weather (its not too hot).
Assuming track temp of about 15 degrees, thats pretty good.

Please read earlier posts in this thread for potential pricing and cost of car-prep.
If you are interested in this event, please add your name.

Interested list:
1) Fuman
2) RallyPlaya

Heads up:
We do need people for
Field Marshals (for safety)
Cameraman
Cook (I doubt people want to eat sandwiches, lol, we'll try to setup a BBQ or something).
I'm probably missing a few, if ppl know what roles I'm missing, feel free to add

[ptfire]

I would be in for a track day. Preferably Shannon Ville or Mosport. Shannonville is far but it is more foregiving than Mosport.

[Fuman]

I would be in for a track day. Preferably Shannon Ville or Mosport. Shannonville is far but it is more foregiving than Mosport.
Shannonville's track is alot wider and larger so its more forgiving if you spin out.
Mosport is a slower track in terms of average km/h/lap.

[REZXPERT]

count me in.

[Fuman]

count me in.
Interested list:
1) Fuman
2) RallyPlaya
3) REZXPERT
4) ptfire

[doughboyr6]

im in

Interested list:
1) Fuman
2) RallyPlaya
3) REZXPERT
4) ptfire
5) doughboyr6

[mazda lover]

Not sure if anybody mentioned it, didn't read all the posts, but if you smack your car up I believe your insurance company won't fix it, just a thought,
good luck. I am out because of the insurance issue. Phone your insurance broker-company and ask them if you are covered for such an event...

[doughboyr6]

that is very likely. On must auto insurance policies, it says damage excluded from speed tests/rallying/racing. I think most ppl are aware of this and are taking the chance. I'm going to granny it around the track.

[RallyPlaya]

Thats Why im Going To take it Easy around the track and eventually i should get a feel for the track. You have to have a level of maturity when you participate in an event like this. This isn't need for speed for Ps2 this is real life with your real car. Understand the risks of insurance i take that risk everyday driving a modded car, thats why im more careful .

[Fuman]

Interested list:
1) Fuman +1 (my friend also has a Mazda3 and is interested)
2) RallyPlaya
3) REZXPERT
4) ptfire
5) doughboyr6
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EQMZUAJezcY&feature=related
In car view of DDT

[davidpetrozza]

Interested list:
1) Fuman +1 (my friend also has a Mazda3 and is interested)
2) RallyPlaya
3) REZXPERT
4) ptfire
5) doughboyr6
6) davidpetrozza

[doughboyr6]

Thats Why im Going To take it Easy around the track and eventually i should get a feel for the track. You have to have a level of maturity when you participate in an event like this. This isn't need for speed for Ps2 this is real life with your real car. Understand the risks of insurance i take that risk everyday driving a modded car, thats why im more careful .

I had a dedicated track bike, so that thing was thrashed....but my car is my daily driver and my ownly car. I can't afford to have anything terrible happen to it....Its my only means to commute to work to earn $ to pay its payments...

[Fuman]

I had a dedicated track bike, so that thing was thrashed....but my car is my daily driver and my ownly car. I can't afford to have anything terrible happen to it....Its my only means to commute to work to earn $ to pay its payments...
Same man! Guess the 3 of us will stick together on the track since we'll be taking it easy, haha

[Skarbro]

that is very likely. On must auto insurance policies, it says damage excluded from speed tests/rallying/racing. I think most ppl are aware of this and are taking the chance. I'm going to granny it around the track.
That is true. It's right in the OAP1. Unless you have some kind of track insurance (which doesn't exist for plated vehicles as far as I know), then this applied to all of us:

1.4 Your Responsibilities
If you fail to meet your responsibilities, claims under this policy, with the exception of certain Accident Benefits, may be denied.
1.4.6
You agree not to use or allow anyone to use the automobile in a race or speed test or for any illegal trade or transportation.

[RX9]

let me find a trailor to tow my RX-7 there, miss 20B's 12K rpm for a long time.

[Ghost]

Interested list:
1) Fuman +1 (my friend also has a Mazda3 and is interested)
2) RallyPlaya
3) REZXPERT
4) ptfire
5) doughboyr6
6) davidpetrozza
7) Ghost

[mleblond]

1) Fuman +1 (my friend also has a Mazda3 and is interested)
2) RallyPlaya
3) REZXPERT
4) ptfire
5) doughboyr6
6) davidpetrozza
7) Ghost
8) mleblond

[Fuman]

Wow, this list is growing a lot faster than I thought.

Interested list:
1) Fuman +1 (my friend also has a Mazda3 and is interested)
2) RallyPlaya
3) REZXPERT
4) ptfire
5) doughboyr6
6) davidpetrozza
7) Ghost

[davidpetrozza]

25 people have already voted. This event may be a go! I hope!

[Fuman]

does anyone have pylons?
that we can use for this event?
(Need to mark corner entry/apex/exit points so
we can setup the track configuration)

[mleblond]

I have maybe 10 small ones (1 foot tall) that I use for hockey practice.

Not sure if anyone knows someone that works for the city and could borrow some...

[Fuman]

I have maybe 10 small ones (1 foot tall) that I use for hockey practice.

Not sure if anyone knows someone that works for the city and could borrow some...

awesome, if this goes through. We'll borrow them =)
We do need more though.
We still have time =)

[Fuman]

That is true. It's right in the OAP1. Unless you have some kind of track insurance (which doesn't exist for plated vehicles as far as I know), then this applied to all of us:


1.4 Your Responsibilities
If you fail to meet your responsibilities, claims under this policy, with the exception of certain Accident Benefits, may be denied.
1.4.6
You agree not to use or allow anyone to use the automobile in a race or speed test or for any illegal trade or transportation.


A lapping day isn't a "race" (we don't time laps), and it isn't a "speed test" (we can go NO where near 180km/h).
there is another section that covers a lapping day. Can't find which one at the moment
You are right in that we are not covered on a lapping day, but we should be if we go to track school.

[mleblond]

http://www.carcontrolschool.com/index.html

I might take the training from these guys...they hosted the prelude one...TM3 could be next?

Seems to be a good thing to learn for better control and education for your car.

And remember it's not a race. Just like playing golf, you compete against yourself to get better.

[Fuman]

http://www.carcontrolschool.com/index.html

I might take the training from these guys...they hosted the prelude one...TM3 could be next?

Seems to be a good thing to learn for better control and education for your car.

And remember it's not a race. Just like playing golf, you compete against yourself to get better.
+1
but it seems like it is out of the budget of most members here.
I took it last year. Its Amazing, I was a lot faster by end of day.
If we go that route, we will not have enough people. We will have to join another car club(s), which is a good thing. It's always a good thing to meet new people.

read this if you have to buy a helmet
Although, we only need a DOT approved helmet. As that instructor states, I do suggest the snell approved one.
If we have a track day (whether its our own or not), I'll try to organize or join another club's GB on helmets.
http://www.hondaprelude.to/forums/showpost.php?p=1172191&postcount=36

please let me know below if you need a helmet:
1) Fuman +1 (my friend also has a Mazda3 and is interested)
2) RallyPlaya
3) REZXPERT
4) ptfire
5) doughboyr6
6) davidpetrozza
7) Ghost
8) mleblond

[RallyPlaya]

I Would need a helmet but can we possibly rent a helmet, yeah i know sounds kind of cheap but im a uni student lol. Ill ask around see if anyones got any helmets lying around. & if i have to buy one where the best place and deal for a helmet?

[Fuman]

I Would need a helmet but can we possibly rent a helmet, yeah i know sounds kind of cheap but im a uni student lol. Ill ask around see if anyones got any helmets lying around. & if i have to buy one where the best place and deal for a helmet?
the following prices are at http://www.snowcity.com/ with hondaprelude.to's GB. (last year)
cheapest DOT approved you can get just under $100.
I got a snell approved for $150 since I am planning to get a bike when I graduate
Just wait until there is a GB you can save a bit of money.

[mleblond]

ebay maybe? for the helmet...or get a friend that drives a bike ;)

[Fuman]

ebay maybe? for the helmet...or get a friend that drives a bike ;)
you need a snug fit for helmets, so I wouldn't suggest ebay unless you are 100% the size is correct.
You may want to rethink asking a friend with a bike.
"Over time the protective foam in the helmet will adjust to the contours of your head. If someone else uses this helmet it will not provide them with as much protection"
from http://www.hjchelmets.com/helmet_usage.htm (go to helmet disposal).
Since it is match to your friend's head. You wearing it will not provide you with the protection it needs (but honestly our car's are not roadster) but your friend needs the 100% fit to the contours of his head.
If you go borrow one, make sure he does not need the full protection of his helmet.

I see that alot of people are voting. This event will be based on the list below. Thus, if you are seriously interested please remember to add your name below. Thank you
1) Fuman +1 (my friend also has a Mazda3 and is interested)
2) RallyPlaya
3) REZXPERT
4) ptfire
5) doughboyr6
6) davidpetrozza
7) Ghost
8) mleblond

[mleblond]

makes sense...I remember my friend saying something like if there's any bad chips in the helmet that it may not protect you as well. But to be honest we are in a car and I (being 6ft2 having that helmet might actually be worse for my neck as I don't have much clearance already. Anyways I'm gonna go see this Honda/Harley moto shop and see what they say and have to offer...

[Fuman]

makes sense...I remember my friend saying something like if there's any bad chips in the helmet that it may not protect you as well. But to be honest we are in a car and I (being 6ft2 having that helmet might actually be worse for my neck as I don't have much clearance already. Anyways I'm gonna go see this Honda/Harley moto shop and see what they say and have to offer...
exactly. I'm just saying don't borrow a helmet from a friend that needs all the protection the helmet can provider (e.g. someone on a bike).

friend of mine just told me the following:
"a Snell M approval is for motorcycle helmets ...perfectly fine for lapping days and ian law school and auto-x events ...however, if anyone plans on doing serious road racing, then a Snell SA approval is needed ....the SA is fire retardant, M is not (not required for motorcycles)"

[doughboyr6]

Does is matter what Snell it is? 95/2000/ or whatever the new one? Or as long as DOT?

[doughboyr6]

A lapping day isn't a "race" (we don't time laps), and it isn't a "speed test" (we can go NO where near 180km/h).
there is another section that covers a lapping day. Can't find which one at the moment
You are right in that we are not covered on a lapping day, but we should be if we go to track school.

i dont' think it matters....close course (track) use of the vehicle should be an exclusion from the policy AFAIK. Are you in insurance FUman?

[mleblond]

Sent an email to carcontrolschool.com. Sounds better and they have pricing for groups of 25. Happy reading!

Hi Mathieu,

You are better off taking the Advanced Autoslalom before the Track School. It will allow you more time on the skid pad etc. and practising the basics of performance driving techniques. There is a lot to learn and it is these techniques that will make you fast. We don't work on the skid pad during the Track School as we are concentrating on the track part. At the Adv. Auto. course, we work with one corner to perfect cornering technique. At the Track School, you are working with 13 corners which is more difficult.

We do have loaner helmets available for the Track School if you need one. If you have your own, you can use that. (if it's in good shape and at least DOT approved)

Here is more info:

Adv. Auotslalom:

April 12th will be our Advanced Autoslalom course and it will be held at PowerAde Centre in Brampton.

To register, simply mail in a cheque ($250 includes gst) to:

ILR Car Control School,
13 Valley Mills Rd.
Mount Albert, Ont.,
L0G 1M0

and we'll let you know when it arrives.

The cost includes handbook, lunch and certificate. We run rain or shine. To prepare your car, have a full tank of gas, remove any objects that move
around and inflate the front tires to about 45 psi (if it does not rain).

You will need to be at the Brampton Centre (see map on our website) for about 8 am.

Track:

The next Track School will be May 18th at Mosport DDT.

The course consists of a full day of classroom and in-car, on-track instruction. We cover a very wide range of topics (racing line, weight transfer, vision training, "Heel & Toe, etc) on how to prepare you and your car for competition driving. You will need to be at Mosport for about 8 am on that day to take care of the paper work and to get ready. We will run until 5 pm and we run rain or shine.

You will also need a helmet for the Track School and your car should be in top mechanical condition with plenty of brake pad material and we recommend fresh brake fluid in your system. You should also have a full tank of gas and you will want to inflate your front tires pressures to about 40 - 45 psi if it does not rain.

To register for our Track School on May 18th at Mosport, simply mail in a cheque ($325 includes gst) to:

ILR Car Control School
13 Valley Mills Rd.
Mount Albert, Ont.
L0G 1M0

and we'll let you know when it arrives. We also have the option of having the skills of a professional photographer to take digital photos of you in action around the track on this exciting day. He (John) has been photographing major races including F1 around the world since the 1960's. For only $40 (cash on that day is fine) John will shoot you at speed in your car and mail out your own CD. Please let us know if you are interested in this unique service. We need to know prior to the day so we know if we have enough to bring him out.

Please let me know if you have any questions.


If you register for both, we ca work a deal for you. You can pay only $550 and we'll throw in the CDs of photos.

[Fuman]

The hondaprelude track school (with the same school) was cheaper.
I never took the advance salom course though.

DO NOT inflate your tires that high.
The RS-As has a MAX cold tire PSI of 44 psi.

I doubt Goodyear forsee people tracking the RS-As.
I went 39 Front 38 Rear.

[mleblond]

Well at lease you don't have to buy a helmet if we do a track school day...

[Fuman]

Well at lease you don't have to buy a helmet if we do a track school day...
True. you can still borrow a helmet if we go with TPC I think.
By yeah, up to the other guys.
If people are up for track school, we can go with TPC.
No point in organizing our own unless we have 25-30 people that want to do school + 20+35 that wants to lap.
right now we have 10 people total. =(

[mleblond]

Yeah I think we scared them away or no one wants to commit to it just yet

As for helmets...is this a good deal?

http://offroaddirect.ca/product_dothelmetstreet.php?colour=SILVER

[doughboyr6]

never heard of the brand...

you have to decide if you want to spend the money for a long term investment for possible future uses or just this one time. Bikers always say don't stinge on the helmet as it is protecting the most vital part of your body....and personally speaking having crashed on the track and hit my head on the pavement at 70kms, my helmet saved my noggen (sp?)

a decent helmet will run you $200-$400 a good helmet will run you $500-$1000 and the best ones over 1g. That said, they all probalby meet DOT standards, its just the features that come with the helmet.

[Fuman]

never heard of the brand...

you have to decide if you want to spend the money for a long term investment for possible future uses or just this one time. Bikers always say don't stinge on the helmet as it is protecting the most vital part of your body....and personally speaking having crashed on the track and hit my head on the pavement at 70kms, my helmet saved my noggen (sp?)

a decent helmet will run you $200-$400 a good helmet will run you $500-$1000 and the best ones over 1g. That said, they all probalby meet DOT standards, its just the features that come with the helmet.
+1
The snell / dot approved one I have cost me almost $150 w/ tax + discount.
I know we are going to just be in a car. But if you foresee yourself becoming competitive, get the snell.

Always TRY on the helmet. Its the same reason you can't buy shoes online unless you tired it on already. The sizing and comfort of each model is different.

[SP33D 3]

im in as well

1) Fuman +1 (my friend also has a Mazda3 and is interested)
2) RallyPlaya
3) REZXPERT
4) ptfire
5) doughboyr6
6) davidpetrozza
7) Ghost
8) mleblond
9) SP33D 3

[davidpetrozza]

I think a lapping day, something like the prelude club did last year would be suffice. A solution would be to break the drivers into three groups:Novice, Intermediate, and Experienced. I am sure everyone knows their driving capabilities, and the more experienced drivers can always offer adivce for those who want to advance into the experienced group throughout the day. Let's face it, the Mazda 3 is no race car, but basic entry and exit out of turns can be learned after a few laps. Like someone said before, we're just lapping, not racing.

What do you guys think? It would deffinitely keep the cost down.

[RallyPlaya]

I Agree to that & I Would like to be part of the beginner group. Other than Go karting ive never done anything like this before and i would like to be on the track with guys similar to me in experience. Im Not doing this to become the next Michael Schumacher just to have a fun experience with my car. i Agree to your idea David.On that Note Might Bring a Friend But he Drives a BMW 318ti is That Alrite with U Guys.

[Fuman]

I disagree, no offense. (to the groups part)
We should stick together with or without track school.
1) As a club event, we don't want to risk having accidents (i.e. the advance groups)
2) It is easier for the beginners to learn if they are able to follow the lines of the slightly more experienced drivers.
3) More drivers can comment / ask about each other's driving. That way, people's skills will grow faster.

I'm sure no one here will be stupid and put others in danger. The reason I've been suggesting track school is just so you have a qualified instructor giving you input for the whole day.

[mleblond]

I disagree, no offense. (to the groups part)
We should stick together with or without track school.
1) As a club event, we don't want to risk having accidents (i.e. the advance groups)
2) It is easier for the beginners to learn if they are able to follow the lines of the slightly more experienced drivers.
3) More drivers can comment / ask about each other's driving. That way, people's skills will grow faster.

I'm sure no one here will be stupid and put others in danger. The reason I've been suggesting track school is just so you have a qualified instructor giving you input for the whole day.

+1 Could be worst to put all beginners together

it's all about having fun, legally.

[Big Dad]

I will go if there is an experienced session and passing is allowed. It is frustrating following a slower car that is driving at half the speed, nervous and not being able to pass. If I wanted that I would take a trip down the DVP.

Btw make sure it is held on a weekend. Enquire about track insurance regulations. Some tracks make you take out insurance for the day. Parker Brothers powersports (416-234-5750) on Dundas by the 427 rents out helmets. Helmets are not usually necessary.

[Fuman]

I will go if there is an experienced session and passing is allowed. It is frustrating following a slower car that is driving at half the speed, nervous and not being able to pass. If I wanted that I would take a trip down the DVP.

Btw make sure it is held on a weekend. Enquire about track insurance regulations. Some tracks make you take out insurance for the day. Parker Brothers powersports (416-234-5750) on Dundas by the 427 rents out helmets. Helmets are not usually necessary.

I don't think we'll have an expert session. Most of us are amateurs, or don't mind being on the track with them. If you don't like, check out http://www.touge.ca/ or http://www.battleendless.com/ They may have an event that you are looking for.

Our rules are likely going be something like the following:
Passing will only be allowed on designated straight aways.
If the person in front of you does not let you pass, DO NOT pass on your own. Just come into the pits talk to the Track Marshall. Track Marshall will wave the person in and talk to them.

If helmets aren't necessary, they won't be mandatory/recommended with track event organizers such as Defcon Racing, Ian Law Racing School, battleendless, and touge.ca.

Thanks for the helmet rental contact info!

[RX9]

I will go if there is an experienced session and passing is allowed. It is frustrating following a slower car that is driving at half the speed, nervous and not being able to pass. If I wanted that I would take a trip down the DVP.

Btw make sure it is held on a weekend. Enquire about track insurance regulations. Some tracks make you take out insurance for the day. Parker Brothers powersports (416-234-5750) on Dundas by the 427 rents out helmets. Helmets are not usually necessary.

take this easy, its just for fun, not a racing.:chuckle

[doughboyr6]

i understand fumans point of view and in some cases makes sense...but IMO and mine only, i still think its better to break off into groups based on experience.

The first session for the beginners can have an experienced driver take them out on 'sighting' laps to learn the lines. No passing whatsoever on this session.

And as for comments and learning lines, on the track days i've been to, the beginners and ask one of the experienced drivers to either show or follow them and feedback can be given after.

I think problems/accidents arise when beginners slow down the faster drivers too much and and they are eager to pass or over zealous on the brakes....

just think of it like a hiway, if everyone is more or less the same speed flow of traffic, there are no problems....problems happen with slow ppl are in fast lanes and all over the place and people gas/brake/gas/brake....etc.

does my point make sense?

[Fuman]

i understand fumans point of view and in some cases makes sense...but IMO and mine only, i still think its better to break off into groups based on experience.

The first session for the beginners can have an experienced driver take them out on 'sighting' laps to learn the lines. No passing whatsoever on this session.

And as for comments and learning lines, on the track days i've been to, the beginners and ask one of the experienced drivers to either show or follow them and feedback can be given after.

I think problems/accidents arise when beginners slow down the faster drivers too much and and they are eager to pass or over zealous on the brakes....

just think of it like a hiway, if everyone is more or less the same speed flow of traffic, there are no problems....problems happen with slow ppl are in fast lanes and all over the place and people gas/brake/gas/brake....etc.

does my point make sense?
I certainly understand Big Dad's point. But the # beginners that we have on the track is going to far out number the people that wants an expert session. I don't think its fair that 90% of the people should be sitting in the pits for the 10% (if even 10%), going crazy. There's also going to be a big headache for the admins if there is an accident.
We can certainly have a vote later on.

Honestly, the chances of you being stuck behind someone that won't let you pass is pretty slim. Being yelled at in the pits for being a jackass is pretty embarrassing. The case sometimes is people not sure if the guy behind him is faster. If after a lap, the guy haven't moved aside, give him a honk on one of the straights or semi-straights. The guy infront can acknowledge the honk by giving a hand gesture (not the middle finger, lol).

Skill level wise, I doubt we'll see a huge gap in skill if people read up and practice a bit on the streets before we go. DO NOT go crazy. Just saying you can practice things like steering work, your lines, your brake timing and such. That reminds me go to www.turnfast.com and read up. (Site is down at the moment).

We can surely do a mini-meet where we prep each other. I'm sure I know something that you don't and vice versa.

Off the top of my head, some of you may want to practice:
Steering Work:
1) Hand over hand when turning.
2) Driving with two hands on the steering wheel (9 and 3). You can use 10-2, but you will get more control at 9 and 3
3) Make sure you are seated properly (no slouching). To check, when you arms are fully extended and put it on top of the steering wheel (12 o'clock). Make sure your entire fist and a wee bit more is hanging OVER the steering wheel. This should mean that when you hands are at 9-3, the bends in your elbows are at 120 degrees.

Braking work:
1) Do ALL your braking on straights (not sure if you can practice this on the streets).
I HIGHLY stress beginners do NOT trail brake in corners. There's one corner in DDT where if you trail brake improperly (which is pretty easy to do), you are off the track.

Lines: (Since turnfast is down, I found thes following link)
not every IMAGE on the site is correct. The double apex (right image) is in reverse.
(As it says, you should aim for the second apex). If you are unsure if the image is correct, just ask.
http://www.kartcity.net/index.php?subj=driving&ctry=ie
Don't worry about this too much, those of us that has been to DDT will
take everyone around the track a few times and show you the track.

Shifting:
Just shift smooth, do not aim for speed, aim for smoothness. Shaving 0.02 seconds off your lap time while damaging your gearbox is meaningless.

Heel & Toe:
someone chime in here please.

[Edmonius]

Well said, Fuman! I would add that everyone should (hopefully) know how to rev-match when downshifting. And I'm not going to try to explain heel-toeing either. Just can't find the words.

So...did we decide on a track? I'd prefer Shannonville, especially if there are a lot of novices. It's slower, wider, flatter, and most importantly, forgiving. Mosport's fun, but IMHO it's more for guys with experience, or for those who are being instructed. The other nice thing about full track at Shanny is that it's so twisty it really does help level the playing field between MZ3's and much more powerful cars.

Anyway, just my 2 cents.

[Fuman]

Well said, Fuman! I would add that everyone should (hopefully) know how to rev-match when downshifting. And I'm not going to try to explain heel-toeing either. Just can't find the words.

So...did we decide on a track? I'd prefer Shannonville, especially if there are a lot of novices. It's slower, wider, flatter, and most importantly, forgiving. Mosport's fun, but IMHO it's more for guys with experience, or for those who are being instructed. The other nice thing about full track at Shanny is that it's so twisty it really does help level the playing field between MZ3's and much more powerful cars.

Anyway, just my 2 cents.
Shannonville (depending on configuration) will be pretty tricky. I personally (maybe you guys are more gifted at this than me) suck at the hairpins that Shannon has. I was taking some of the corners improperly and spun my friend's car a few times, he was pretty pissed, lol. Got an experienced drive to come in my car and told me what I was doing wrong, my friend had no idea
Shannonville's cost will be higher. Another $40 (in gas fees). Speed's higher and further away. We can also vote on this later on.
DDT 1 tank for the day with a bit over
Shannonville 1.5 to 2 tanks.

DDT is A LOT slower than Shannonville, I was on Full / Pro track configurations though. Were you referring to Nelson and or Fabi?
Shannon is a lot wider though. I can't comment on the DDT is for those being instructed. I was instructed at both tracks, well sort of, lol.

Shannonville is more forgiving, but DDT's slower average speed compensates for it.

Guys, any idea how to come up the track in an event of an oil or coolant spill?

[doughboyr6]

clean up you mean? saw dust right.....what is it that they spread on the ground then use a broom to sweep up?

[Fuman]

clean up you mean? saw dust right.....what is it that they spread on the ground then use a broom to sweep up?
To get rid of oil / coolant and other fluid spills on the track.
We have to be prepared if we are organizing our own event.

So they use saw dust?

[Big Dad]

You can use kity litter or concrete dust.

[RX9]

heel and toe:

this movement needs lot practics! dont do that if you are not sure how it work.

how it work to effect ur in and out corner speed:
for most engins, 5000-6500 rpm will give you the quickest acc in speed (rotary and s2000s' around 8000rpm). and engin and tranny slow down ur car with a little break access. use it when you need the quickest turn.

how to do?
for exmpl: while you are doing 80km/h heading to a hair pin, you need to slow down around 40km/h for save turn while you want the quickest acc after this turn, then
1. fully press down the cluch
2. step on the break lightly on toe<-- this may reduce the speed 5km/h,
3. step on the gas padel lightly on heel <-- this will rev the engin to keep the rpm
4. downshift 1 level
5. release cluch and break, reuse toe for gas
6. still to farst? do that again.

well, sounds prety easy? try it with step 1 to 5 in the same time. if anyone really like to learn this trick, i can hand on teach you, cant really tell by wordz. dont worry about it for your cluch, if you do it corectly, its save and you gonna love it.

ps: you may need to mod the gas paddle a bit higher, b/c 3's break and gas are very close, i found another way to do it without mod them, both on 3 and speed.

[Fuman]

Just to add a little bit to RX9's post.
there's two ways for your right foot movement.
I'm not sure which fits our cars more
one is to bleep the throttle/brake without the heel
http://a332.g.akamai.net/f/332/936/12h/www.edmunds.com/media/advice/youngdrivers/heel.toe.downshift/heel.toe.3.500.jpg

the other way is this:
http://www.drivingfast.net/car_control/heel_and_toe_files/3.png


You can use kity litter or concrete dust.
thanks! guess we'll have to go buy some kitty litter.

[doughboyr6]

i can't do the 2nd one, its too un-natural for me and with the huge spacing gap on the 3, it makes it even harder.

with that said, i can't really do the first one that well either on the 3 again due to the huge spacing difference.

I used to do it flawlessly on my parents old maxima. The brake when depressed 1/4-1/2 was perfectly level with the gas and i could use the edge of my foot to blip it....

i don't think i'll be able to do it on the 3 at all, unless i'm braking late and hard and the brake pedal is almost to the floor.....then it will be level with the gas.

[MAZDA Kitten]

I'm down!

Are helmets required? Gotta dig up my old motorcycle helmet heheheh havent worn it in ages

[Fuman]

I'm down!

Are helmets required? Gotta dig up my old motorcycle helmet heheheh havent worn it in ages
yup! I put your name down =p.
1) Fuman +1 (my friend also has a Mazda3 and is interested)
2) RallyPlaya
3) REZXPERT
4) ptfire
5) doughboyr6
6) davidpetrozza
7) Ghost
8) mleblond
9) SP33D 3
10) MAZDA Kitten

Guys/lady, if you guys can, check the condition of your brake pads now.
Keep in mind you have to break in brake pads.

[RallyPlaya]

Got Some quick questions that attain directly to the event.
With the track events do the tires usually suffer very bad wear and tear?
Do u recommend doing this with a lowered suspension or stock?
Im 18years old is there gonna be a ton of paperwork for me to do?
Can I Bring a Friend That has a modded BMW to the track, Can we bring friends in general to watch?

[Fuman]

Got Some quick questions that attain directly to the event.
With the track events do the tires usually suffer very bad wear and tear?
RS-As will be alright. RS-A with 50% tread can last 3 9-5 track days and still have enough tread left for the season.
Your tires may look deformed after. Remember to do cool-down laps.

Do u recommend doing this with a lowered suspension or stock?
If your car is stock now, left it stock. Just so you can mod it to your taste in terms of handling after the track day
Springs w/stock struts is alright if it is dry. When it is wet, weight shifting becomes really really sensitive.

Im 18years old is there gonna be a ton of paperwork for me to do?
no. Just signing a piece of paper saying TM3/Track owners aren't responsible if an accident happens. Or something like that

Can I Bring a Friend That has a modded BMW to the track, Can we bring friends in general to watch?
This will be up to other members. Some people wanted TM3 only. I personally don't care.

[RX9]

at lease i dont care ppl drive other cars on TM3 track day, but make sure follow the rules, its just for fun, no show offs. i had a bad time once, a asshead crashed couple cars (one is my buddy's) after showing off b/c he though his car is the quickest on the group, good racer wont need to show off to gain respect.

[Fuman]

k turnfast.com is back
http://www.turnfast.com/tech_intro/intro_protocol.shtml
<-- PLEASE READ... PLEASE
keep in mind this is a track day. Racing/time attack stuff doesn't apply.

If you have time read through the site. It'll really help prep you.
If you have anything you don't understand please ask.

For example, How does shifting the weight to the front help? Doesn't it just cause understeer?
(A question I had before I went to track school. I was rather confused.) Answer: You want a bit more weight at the front so the tires doing the turning have more grip.

[Fuman]

everyone on the interest list, please check your PMs.
If you didn't get one from me, please PM me.

[Videcak]

Definitely something I may consider depending on the final details.

[Fuman]

we are going to a track school / lapping day with another car club.
Those interested, please shoot me a PM.

[mogul_pro]

1) Fuman +1 (my friend also has a Mazda3 and is interested)
2) RallyPlaya
3) REZXPERT
4) ptfire
5) doughboyr6
6) davidpetrozza
7) Ghost
8) mleblond
9) SP33D 3
10) MAZDA Kitten
11) Mogul_Pro

[mazda lover]

at lease i dont care ppl drive other cars on TM3 track day, but make sure follow the rules, its just for fun, no show offs. i had a bad time once, a asshead crashed couple cars (one is my buddy's) after showing off b/c he though his car is the quickest on the group, good racer wont need to show off to gain respect.


and I am sure your buddies insurance didn't pay to have his car fixed

[Fuman]

http://www.torontomazda3.ca/forum/showthread.php?goto=newpost&t=24772
there should be a few of us going.
I'll be there just not sure if I'll be a spectator or a lapper yet.

[Fobio]

What are the logistics for the day with the hondaprelude club so far? can we merge the threads?

Pls add me to the list!

1) Fuman +1 (my friend also has a Mazda3 and is interested)
2) RallyPlaya
3) REZXPERT
4) ptfire
5) doughboyr6
6) davidpetrozza
7) Ghost
8) mleblond
9) SP33D 3
10) MAZDA Kitten
11) Mogul_Pro
12) Fobio