Brakes and Hawk HPS

[Jackal]

Hi! I was thinking of getting Hawk HPS some time soon. Just a couple of questions about them.

1) Are they really better than the OEM brakes from your experience?

2) I know it's different for everyone depending on use of brakes but...if someone was doing about 40% highway, 60% city how long (KMs) would OEM brakes last in general? At what point, if you are presently using them, did you change ove to Hawk HPS.

3) If you were using them then changed your mind, why are you no longer using them?

I would like to give these a try on my 2010 GT.

[PearlM3]

I have the magnum x-drilled rotors, and hawk pads that Peter sells, and honestly I HATE THEM!!!, not to sure if it's the pads, or the rotors, but my braking now is not as tight as it used to be.

[Jackal]

I have the magnum x-drilled rotors, and hawk pads that Peter sells, and honestly I HATE THEM!!!, not to sure if it's the pads, or the rotors, but my braking now is not as tight as it used to be.

Woah sorry to hear that. Good to hear both positive and negative feedback on these.

Peter said I didn't need to get the rotors. Anyone install the Hawk HPS without the magnum x-drilled rotors?

[S.F.W.]

I had the Hawk HPS pads on my 3 Sedan, and was very pleased. However, I would combine them with OEM rotors instead of the Magnums.

[Jackal]

I had the Hawk HPS pads on my 3 Sedan, and was very pleased. However, I would combine them with OEM rotors instead of the Magnums.

Thanks. That's what the NextMod guy (lol) said. No need to buy rotors...just use OEM. Thanks for feedback.

[SomeGuy]

I have the magnum x-drilled rotors, and hawk pads that Peter sells, and honestly I HATE THEM!!!, not to sure if it's the pads, or the rotors, but my braking now is not as tight as it used to be.

After about 60,000km on the OEM stuff I had warped my front rotors and front pads were done (I was pretty hard on my brakes). Rears were still ok at that point but I decided to switch all 4 corners to the same setup as above. I have to agree, they sucked for the first maybe 10,000km. I think it's the rotors and not the pads, the finish on them is very very shiny and it takes a while to get them smoothed out and bite better. Once the rotors looked dull they started to perform better and I'd say at that point they performed on par with the OEM brakes. Did the brake swap with the help of a friend but had mazda check them after the install because I was shocked at how lousy they were and they said the HPS pads did not quite sit perfectly and grinding down the tabs a bit to make them sit better. As the pads settle the brake force does improve as well. Lastly, they do need a little bit of warmth in the pads to perform their best, give them 5-10 minutes of normal city driving and then they would grab way better. Remember too to bed in the brakes (which I did a couple times). So all that said, I WOULD NOT buy the magnum rotors again but I would definitely give the HPS pads another try.

[shu5892001]

HPS are nice, but magnum rotors are shit, so I don't blame my pads I blame my rotors...

[omalak]

Running HAWK HPS Pads, with AMICO blanks all picked up from Peter.

Bought the Amico discs becasue they were fairly cheap.

Overall.. I would not buy Hawks again, they give off way too much dust! I honestly cant tell the difference in day to day driving.

The AMICO blanks SUCK! they rust at the hub like a bitch! I have only run them one year and my disc looks like its from a 10 year old car. I am going to replace the discs this summer with OEM blanks, never had an issue with them.

I would suggest you run HAWKS and OEM, or just stick to OEM pads and OEM discs.

[S.F.W.]

Overall.. I would not buy Hawks again, they give off way too much dust! I honestly cant tell the difference in day to day driving.



That is really surprising my Hawk HPS did not give off much dust.

[omalak]

Mine give off quite a bit, unless its due to the discs somehow. Either way, i will find out this spring when i revert back to OEM discs.

My wheels are coated black though, maybe i just see more dust than what the avg person might see

[Kappa]

just got new brakes. cross drilled with hps work great on my car... but then again i wasnt thinking i was going to pay 200 bucks for front brakes and get brembos... lol

[bukjoe]

I need to replace all 4 of my rotors and brakes in the summer time....so the best set up would be Hawks Brake Pads and OEM Rotors? Where's the best place to pick these up? thanks!

[Kwokalobster]

Magnum rotors are garbage imo but on the other hand love the Hawk HPS pads.
This is my setup: XtremeStop crossed drilled rotors & Hawk HPS pads
http://i1089.photobucket.com/albums/i351/Kwokalobster/Photo0176.jpg

[RedRaptor]

I'm looking to get the DBA 4000XS (Cross Drilled and Slotted) paired with Hawk HPS. Anyone running this set up?

[Jackal]

Thanks guys for the positive and negative feedback. Leaning towards giving them a shot.
Oh yeah. Thanks to Egor for texting me what he thinks about these brakes.

More reviews?

[Kappa]

I'm looking to get the DBA 4000XS (Cross Drilled and Slotted) paired with Hawk HPS. Anyone running this set up?

unless you track the car a lot and always run the risk of glazing your brake pads why run slotted? or is it just a personal thing

[omalak]

unless you track the car a lot and always run the risk of glazing your brake pads why run slotted? or is it just a personal thing

+5 hp using slotted rotors!!

[S.F.W.]

I'm looking to get the DBA 4000XS (Cross Drilled and Slotted) paired with Hawk HPS. Anyone running this set up?

Talk to Taz4432, I believe he is using this setup.

[azn_outlaw]

For rotors as I always recommend stay far away from cross drilled / slotted,

looks pretty but thats about it..... Canadian winter weather, will kill them instantly and sure dont like the idea that cross drilled can crack at any given moment no thanks

Stick with a good OEM aftermarket blank rotors for all 4 rotors (Napa is great choice for that)

Pad wise, if you want try out EBC Red for the fronts, and rears, any really affordable pad, no need to go crazy with those, I think Akebono makes an application for your car

[Kwokalobster]

+5 hp using slotted rotors!!

+1 LOOOOL!

[Jackal]

For rotors as I always recommend stay far away from cross drilled / slotted,

looks pretty but thats about it..... Canadian winter weather, will kill them instantly and sure dont like the idea that cross drilled can crack at any given moment no thanks

Stick with a good OEM aftermarket blank rotors for all 4 rotors (Napa is great choice for that)

Pad wise, if you want try out EBC Red for the fronts, and rears, any really affordable pad, no need to go crazy with those, I think Akebono makes an application for your car

I heard Akebono brakes are really good too from my cousin who owns a garage specializing in Japanese cars.

[tracking]

Agree about sticking with blanks. Slotted, drilled do look nicer!!!!

[MAZDA Kitten]

That is really surprising my Hawk HPS did not give off much dust.

I agree. I pretty much only run Hawk HPS now with OEM rotors; no issues and brake dust is very little. Trust me - try EBC Green Stuff and then you'll know what bad brake dust is.

[Kappa]

For rotors as I always recommend stay far away from cross drilled / slotted,

looks pretty but thats about it..... Canadian winter weather, will kill them instantly and sure dont like the idea that cross drilled can crack at any given moment no thanks



lol what facts do you have to base this on?

[azn_outlaw]

lol what facts do you have to base this on?

This:

Then from Grassroots Motorsports:


Quote:
"Crossdrilling your rotors might look neat, but what is it really doing for you? Well, unless your car is using brake pads from the '40s and 50s, not a whole lot. Rotors were first drilled because early brake pad materials gave off gasses when heated to racing temperatures, a process known as "gassing out." ...It was an effective solution, but today's friction materials do not exhibit the some gassing out phenomenon as the early pads. Contrary to popular belief, they don't lower temperatures. (In fact, by removing weight from the rotor, they can actually cause temperatures to increase a little.) These holes create stress risers that allow the rotor to crack sooner, and make a mess of brake pads--sort of like a cheese grater rubbing against them at every stop. Want more evidence? Look at NASCAR or F1. You would think that if drilling holes in the rotor was the hot ticket, these teams would be doing it...Slotting rotors, on the other hand, might be a consideration if your sanctioning body allows for it. Cutting thin slots across the face of the rotor can actually help to clean the face of the brake pads over time, helping to reduce the glazing often found during high-speed use which can lower the coefficient of friction. While there may still be a small concern over creating stress risers in the face of the rotor, if the slots are shallow and cut properly, the trade-off appears to be worth the risk. (Have you looked at a NASCAR rotor lately?)


I will leave at this.....

[RedRaptor]

I'm going to admit it. I want cross drilled and slotted because I'm a ricer, not because I'm a racer.

I don't track my car nor do I plan to. But that doesn't mean it can't look good. :)

[Kappa]

only reason i was asking was because (correct me if im wrong bec i might be) slotted will make sure you dont glaze your pads so you dont run the risk of having no brakes when they get really hot. but they also eat pads much faster.

[Jackal]

Well after all these reviews, I ordered a set of Hawk HPS pads from NextMod for Spring. Thanks for all the reviews and advice. I know to expect that they won't be great for the first two weeks but great after that.

[hfdayc]

im using HPS pad with brembos rotors. so far so good

[Jackal]

Picked them up today. Will get them installed in a month or so.

[acrossthec]

Just put on new blank OEM rotors and Hawk HPS pads about three weeks ago now. Pretty happy with the setup so far, though I had to bed them a couple times before they really gave me the grip I was looking for/used to. Can't comment on the brake dust just yet, if it's there it's blending into the salt and grime on the winter steelies, lol.

[zmz3]

This could be out of topic, but it's related in some way or another.

My current Mazda 3, the brakes feel rather soft. I feel like I press about 40% of the total range to get a nice decent grip, talking to some members, that doesn't seem to be the case with their cars. I have original rotors, with dealer (non mazda) installed brake pads. They were put in when the car was purchased about 10,000kms ago. The brakes just don't feel like my old civic where I had disc + drum... The Civic grabbed a lot quicker...

If someone jumps in front of me, I will probably change lanes and hit the other car lool. Cause I don't think I can stop in time. Seriously though, any of the members here think that brake pads make that much of a difference? all the way to brake feel? and pedal braking distance?

I was going to purchase HPS pads and put new rotors in summer, but I wanted to see if that would actually make any difference? before I empty my wallet

I have taken it to Mazda dealership, and they said it was within requirements and no issues found. Brake fluid was replaced 1.5 month ago. I also took it to Jimmy and he 'bedded' the brakes, it felt a bit better, but now again, it seems to be very lousy...

My brakes certainly are not linear :bang

[SomeGuy]

Cheap pads can make a HUGE difference in the amount of bite.

[kckev99]

Hawk HPS produce too much dust gives your rims a brownish red colour.

I did not notice a significant diff from OE pads.

I prefer EBC green stuff for street use. Less dusting or less noticeable dust. Feels equally as good as HAWK.

[kckev99]

This could be out of topic, but it's related in some way or another.

My current Mazda 3, the brakes feel rather soft. I feel like I press about 40% of the total range to get a nice decent grip, talking to some members, that doesn't seem to be the case with their cars. I have original rotors, with dealer (non mazda) installed brake pads. They were put in when the car was purchased about 10,000kms ago. The brakes just don't feel like my old civic where I had disc + drum... The Civic grabbed a lot quicker...

If someone jumps in front of me, I will probably change lanes and hit the other car lool. Cause I don't think I can stop in time. Seriously though, any of the members here think that brake pads make that much of a difference? all the way to brake feel? and pedal braking distance?

I was going to purchase HPS pads and put new rotors in summer, but I wanted to see if that would actually make any difference? before I empty my wallet

I have taken it to Mazda dealership, and they said it was within requirements and no issues found. Brake fluid was replaced 1.5 month ago. I also took it to Jimmy and he 'bedded' the brakes, it felt a bit better, but now again, it seems to be very lousy...

My brakes certainly are not linear :bang

If after you've installed more aggressive pads and bled your brakes and your sure your Master brake cylinder are in good shape your next step is to upgrade the brake lines. The OE rubber hoses has a lot of flex and give. So when you increase the hydraulic pressure by depressing the brakes a lot of it is wasted on your flexing hoses.

If you want a definitive feel for your brakes you need Stainless Steel braided lines. Guaranteed to give you better feel and responsiveness to your brakes. Feeling is night and day. This is a cheap upgrade and worth it if you ever plan to track or autoX. Also improves safety too.

My observations are subjective but I notice two improvements with ABS after installing SS lines. ABS goes off for shorter period of time especially when applying brakes over certain bumps that i encounter frequently. Also ABS actuator seems to pulsate much faster with SS braided lines.

Just short of that is a complete brake over haul with a more powerful brake master cylinder + big brake kit. along with that you'll need bigger rims and tires. This will cost much more $$$

[zmz3]

If after you've installed more aggressive pads and bled your brakes and your sure your Master brake cylinder are in good shape your next step is to upgrade the brake lines. The OE rubber hoses has a lot of flex and give. So when you increase the hydraulic pressure by depressing the brakes a lot of it is wasted on your flexing hoses.

If you want a definitive feel for your brakes you need Stainless Steel braided lines. Guaranteed to give you better feel and responsiveness to your brakes. Feeling is night and day. This is a cheap upgrade and worth it if you ever plan to track or autoX. Also improves safety too.

My observations are subjective but I notice two improvements with ABS after installing SS lines. ABS goes off for shorter period of time especially when applying brakes over certain bumps that i encounter frequently. Also ABS actuator seems to pulsate much faster with SS braided lines.

Just short of that is a complete brake over haul with a more powerful brake master cylinder + big brake kit. along with that you'll need bigger rims and tires. This will cost much more $$$

Thank you for that detailed reply.

I have yet to replace the dealer installed pads, but I will be soon with stock ones or possibly hawk HPS. Haven't decided yet as I am not sure of benefit, im still reading about Hawk HPS though

Any ideas how much SS lines replacement would cost?

I need to figure out how to check my master brake cylinder is in good shape, any shops you recommend?

Thank you

[sol_searchin]

EBC +1, Hawk's are crappy - dust, squeal, and wear down quick

[kckev99]

EBC +1, Hawk's are crappy - dust, squeal, and wear down quick
Agreed... Squealing and dusting are the biggest issues

[kckev99]

Thank you for that detailed reply.

I have yet to replace the dealer installed pads, but I will be soon with stock ones or possibly hawk HPS. Haven't decided yet as I am not sure of benefit, im still reading about Hawk HPS though

Any ideas how much SS lines replacement would cost?

I need to figure out how to check my master brake cylinder is in good shape, any shops you recommend?

Thank you

I don't know what it costs for Mazda 3 but it was less than $200 if I remember correctly for my Honda. You will need to bleed your brakes once you install your new SS lines. I recommend doing this when replacing your brakes to reduce the amount of duplicated work.

Check with NextMod or SpeedTech in Markham.

[n00bMeiSter]

The brakes just don't feel like my old civic where I had disc + drum... The Civic grabbed a lot quicker...

Civic is (or may be, depending on the year and model) lighter and smaller than a mazda 3. And the engine may not have been as powerful (not that a mazda 3 engine is all that powerful to begin with).

[n00bMeiSter]

So for those people that hate EBC and hate Hawk because they have too much dust, what do you use / recommend?

[Cab0oze]

If your pads are squealing, its because you did not do a good job installing them. i have hawks HPS up front, hawks ceramic in the rear, and magnum xdrilled rotors and they have zero squeal, and Ive never noticed much dust (but I dont use the brakes much haha)

So far I have had OE pads, Cheap Magnum noname pads, and hawks.
Magnum no name pads were great except that in heavy rain there would be a 2 second lag where there would be ZERO brake bite. I took them off after a year cus a bad brake line ruined a rotor and I figured I may as well replace everything at once.
Hawks have a very linear bite and do not fade. They lack the strong initial bite of the OE pads.

My advice: Wax your wheels, and dont use brake dust as an excuse to avoid a pad. OE pads are top notch minus the dust, so get them if they're cheapest, if not get EBC or hawks or something, as long as its not a cheap no-name pad.

[kckev99]

If your pads are squealing, its because you did not do a good job installing them. i have hawks HPS up front, hawks ceramic in the rear, and magnum xdrilled rotors and they have zero squeal, and Ive never noticed much dust (but I dont use the brakes much haha)

So far I have had OE pads, Cheap Magnum noname pads, and hawks.
Magnum no name pads were great except that in heavy rain there would be a 2 second lag where there would be ZERO brake bite. I took them off after a year cus a bad brake line ruined a rotor and I figured I may as well replace everything at once.
Hawks have a very linear bite and do not fade. They lack the strong initial bite of the OE pads.

My advice: Wax your wheels, and dont use brake dust as an excuse to avoid a pad. OE pads are top notch minus the dust, so get them if they're cheapest, if not get EBC or hawks or something, as long as its not a cheap no-name pad.

I've put enough mileage on both Hawk and EBC pads and I have to say I prefer EBC.

I guess each formula is different for each car however I can only say from my past experience that Hawk HPS+ will dust much more than EBC Green. Both offer good performance. Since they are both the same price I would prefer the EBC.

In addition the squealing is an inherent problem with this model of pad from Hawk.... do your research, HPS is notorious for squealing. Some say it is resolved by removing the metal shim which is not recommended by manufacturer for obvious reasons. You can put as much anti-squeal compound you want but it won't stop it from squealing at low speeds unless you remove the shims. The noise is pretty light so unless your observant you likely won't notice it.

BTW dusting is not a result of how much you use your brakes. It's result of the friction between the pad and rotor when using your brakes in general. My last set of Hawk pads lasted me to 115 000kms and my set before that was the original OE set that took me to 125 000 kms. My OE pads would have lasted longer but I decided to swap them out as i was upgrading my brake lines and putting in high temp fluid get her ready for the track.

Out of the 258 000 kms on my car I can safely say EBC were the most satisfying for street use.

As for x-drilled rotors... most people don't need them unless you plan to track your car. For daily street use you'll never put enough heat in them to notice the difference in brake fade between x-drilled/slotted and blank rotors. Even on the track you have to be very abusive to even cook your brakes. When I was Mosport DDT with blank rotors, i did not notice any fade at all. This track is harsh on brakes... most guys who had fade were the ones who neglected to bleed their brakes before coming to the track.

In fact I've tried Power Slot slotted rotors for every day driving on an old 98 Integra GS-R and they were way too noisy for my liking. Not worth the money for everyday driving unless you just want the look.

If you want more aggressive pads there are other brands and models... Project Mu, Endless etc.

[Cab0oze]

In response to your post, just to make sure i didnt' give off the wrong impression:

1. Like i said, my brakes never ever ever squeal, and all i did was use anti-squeal compound during the install... so its not a guaranteed thign
2. Hawk HPS and HPS+ are very very different. HPS+ are for the track, and are most likely crap for street use
3. I know dusting is not purely a function of how much you use your brakes, but my commute is 99% highway, so it is in my case. I use my brakes when backing out of my parking garage, and pulling into my parking spot at work (except in the winter when I just finish it off with an ebrake slide, then im not even using my fronts haha)
4. I love how my crossdrilled rotors look, but I would never recommend them to anyone for any other reason. They are impractical (most garages wont resurface them if required), decrease your total braking potential due to less surface area, rust more, and are a bit noisier than blanks.

Hope that helps someone.

[Jackal]

Hey all.
What does it mean to 'bleed' your brakes and to 'bed' your brakes? I think I would rather bed than bleed anything. Lol. But seriously....

[Cab0oze]

Hey all.
What does it mean to 'bleed' your brakes and to 'bed' your brakes? I think I would rather bed than bleed anything. Lol. But seriously....

Bleeding brakes is opening the bleeder valve and getting air out of your lines. Air in your brake fluid is not good. Google bleed brakes youtube to see how to do it.

Bedding your brakes is following a certain procedure involving progressively hard braking with no brake dragging in order to ensure that the mating between your new pads and rotors is optimal.

Hope that helps.

[Zoom Zoom Boy]

Hawk HPS pads= No squeal.

Hawk HP+ pads= Squeal like a stuck pig.

[shu5892001]

Isn't it HPS and HP+?

[sol_searchin]

^ Ya your right, Both pads are shit anyways, EBC is a far better pad. For those non believer's i say try out EBC, you won't be dissappointed.

[shu5892001]

I am hesitant to get ebc redstuff because of this:

http://www.torontomazda3.ca/forum/showthread.php?22453-EBC-Redstuff-%28ceramic%29-Review

[Zoom Zoom Boy]

Isn't it HPS and HP+?

Shit, yes. Typo. Edit FTW.

[Jackal]

Isn't it HPS and HP+?

That's exactly what he wrote. Lol. Next time you gotta reply with quote Zoom Zoom Boy for evidence. Lol.

[Zoom Zoom Boy]

That's exactly what he wrote. Lol. Next time you gotta reply with quote Zoom Zoom Boy for evidence. Lol.

I'd just use the super mod powers to change it anyway I want... :super smiley:superman

[Jackal]

I'd just use the super mod powers to change it anyway I want... :super smiley:superman

:mod power smiley:bang

[shu5892001]

I'd just use the super mod powers to change it anyway I want... :super smiley:superman
:chuckle

[Booter22]

I had cross drilled and slotted on my old car, and i found there was a larger difference from the stock rotors. When it comes time on this car i may just get them again.

[Jackal]

Well I was about to get them installed but Jimmy said I should wait because my oem brakes still have 80% front and 90% rear and they are working well. I'll have to wait another year. I appreciate Jimmy at SP's honesty and will go to him when I finally install them.

[lay624]

Hawk HPS pads= No squeal.

Hawk HP+ pads= Squeal like a stuck pig.

+1, I am a new victim of the squeal :bang

[CallySpd]

Only squealing when cold or wet no?

[ColomboM3]

I have the Hawk HPS on the front replaced last year (with blank rotors) and they seem to be working fine right now and I do quite a bit of braking on my rush hour commute.

I'm looking to replace the back ones now (still looking to use the Hawk HPS pads), has anyone had any experience with Raybestos Rotors? What's the difference between the Raybestos Advanced technology rotors and the Professional grade ones?

[JaYson]

question: anyone do their own pad replacement with HAWK HPS pads?

do the rear pads not have the same clipping mechanism as the EBC Green stuff pads? ie. these clips? :

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b97/gabehano/Step7.jpg




also

[Cab0oze]

Yeah, they have the clips...