Hotchkis Front Sway Bar Noise?

[philipfreire]

I heard about this over at M3F and I cant seem to find much info on here. Theres a lot of confusion and I am curious if anyone with Hotchkis front sway bars are experiencing front knocking noises?

I get this mostly on bumps and its clearly coming from the front (cant tell which side).

I checked the endlinks and they are tight and fine. Jimmy @ Street performance thinks its the bar hitting the sub frame. I see a few people on the M3Forums say this. Is there any fix? Does anyone get this with Racing beat or any other sway bars?

Thanks in advance. :)

[cwp_sedan]

AWR end links. Check 'em out.

http://www.mazda3forums.com/index.php?topic=122885.msg2667700#msg2667700

http://www.mazda3forums.com/index.php?topic=95454.msg1873500#msg1873500

[philipfreire]

I'm hearing some negativity on these AWR. I'm not sure I want to buy something that wont fix the issue or make it worse. :(
I found several threads on AWR that are negative and a lot of FS threads on these things.

I'm finding good things on Powergrids... I see I missed Fobio's GB. Since I'm talking about this have you guys who bought from that GB install them? How are they?



I've heard the AWR aren't so good. They are heim joints and the lubrication isn't sealed inside a rubber boot. When the lubrication washes out they rattle then they freeze up altogether. The powergrip are the same as the oem (THK resin ball joints) but they use grade 8 steel dipped in an aquas rust proofing solution. You install them and don't have to worry about lubricating them. The power grid are heavy duty.

"THK Ball Links: Each THK Ball Link is composed of a high-precision ball bearing, a die-cast holder, and a shank connected to the ball by a special welding method. Through a unique production process, the mirror surface of the ball bearing is copied onto the inner mounting surface for perfect contact between them, achieving outstanding wear resistance, exceedingly smooth motion, and high strength."

[Thrizzl3]

i gotta tighten my endlinks and check my bushings too see if they are dried out :(

[cwp_sedan]

Have you confirmed that they are in fact rubbing/hitting the frame?

[Donutz]

I have no knocking with my racingbeat. My advice would be to pick up some Powergrid front end links. I just installed a set this weekend and they make a world of difference.

[philipfreire]

Have you confirmed that they are in fact rubbing/hitting the frame?

I went in to Jimmy on Friday and he checked everything. He said the endlinks were okay and said he thinks its the swaybar hitting the sub frame... maybe with adjustable endlinks it can help it from hitting on bumps? Im not sure how this suspension setup works.. if someone could help me out?

[philipfreire]

I have no knocking with my racingbeat. My advice would be to pick up some Powergrid front end links. I just installed a set this weekend and they make a world of difference.

No knocking before the install of the Powergrids? What noticeable difference did you feel?

[cwp_sedan]

This might help you more. It has visuals.

http://www.mazda3forums.com/index.php?topic=97199.0

[Donutz]

I'll say that I didn't have any knocking, however, with the Powergrids the front is quieter. Here's a quick run down on the benefits I've experienced:

- quieter
- car changes direction much smoother; there is a less abrupt feeling.
- there is a better feeling of contact with the road. The feeling is less bumpy, and the feedback through the wheel is improved.
- steering wheel feels lighter.

I suspect that I had preload and there was some deflection in the oem end links.

[philipfreire]

I'll say that I didn't have any knocking, however, with the Powergrids the front is quieter. Here's a quick run down on the benefits I've experienced:

- quieter
- car changes direction much smoother; there is a less abrupt feeling.
- there is a better feeling of contact with the road. The feeling is less bumpy, and the feedback through the wheel is improved.
- steering wheel feels lighter.

I suspect that I had preload and there was some deflection in the oem end links.

Thank you.

[philipfreire]

This might help you more. It has visuals.

http://www.mazda3forums.com/index.php?topic=97199.0

Thank you,

Read the whole thread. Seems like a bad design on the bar itself. I am going to look into a Racing Beat front sway bar.

[Shawn]

I have Hotchkis, no issues on the front. Rear, when really really cold I get a clunk. Plan on shimming that this summer.
Jimmy did my fronts, not rears, as the wrong bushings were in the package. I probably bugged Jimmy, as I wanted the front sub frame as close to position where it was before install.

[philipfreire]

Okay, So I was at Jimmy's today to swap out the Hotchkis sway bars for OEM Mazdaspeed3 Sway bars (both front and back). The noise is still there!!!!!!

I told Jimmy and he had no idea... JonJon came by and I told him of the problem so we went for a test drive.. He suspected the struts but theres no leaks.. so he then suspected the engine mount as he had this issue in the past. Jimmy inspected the mount and saw it cracked.... Thank you JonJon!

I went right away to Westowne Mazda and they took the car for a drive and inspected everything. They cant see anything wrong with the suspension but suspect the aftermarket lowering springs as it looks like the coils are rubbing up against eachother. I can't see that causing a clunking sound at low RPM over bumps... They also found the engine mount was completely broken. They replaced it under warranty.

I took it for a drive after and immediately heard the clunking sound. I went out to get new sways thinking it was the sway bars and have done nothing but waste money now :( No one can seem to find the issue. Maybe it needs aftermarket end links? I dont really want to waste money when I dont know what the problem is...

What do I do? Anyone? Help!?

[aris]

My car was also making a clunking sound... It turned out to be my brakes...

[philipfreire]

Over bumps? I dont get a clunking noise on braking... just going slowly (low rpm) over bumps...

[aris]

Over bumps? I dont get a clunking noise on braking... just going slowly (low rpm) over bumps...


Ya... I can't remember exactly what my brother did to stop it but he fixed it last summer when I was in Greece ...(if I remember correctly the pads were sitting lose and that was cause my clunking noice)

[philipfreire]

I'm so confused. I dont know what this could be. I'm going to take it to QEW tomorrow and have them look at it. It's bothering me

[philipfreire]

The lowered mk2 front end CLUNK. The FINAL ANSWER.

Ok, so you've lowered your car with Eibachs or Suspension Techniques springs and now you have a nasty clunking noise from your front end when you hit harsh bumps that you just can't seem to locate. Well here is the answer my friends. There is nothing wrong with your car, its behaving exactly as it should. You see, the Eibachs and STs are progressive springs. This means they compress at different rates at different levels of compression. At one end of the spring are a bunch of tightly packed coils, at the other, wider spaced ones. The tightly packed ones are the softies to help make normal driving more comfertable. Now this isn't news to me or most of you either I assume, but what I just learned last night is how progressive springs work exactly. I always assumed that the tightly packed coils would compress a little more then the other ones, but still compress with them. The both of them working together at the same time to provide a comferatable ride. Well that doesn't make any sense if you think about it. The way progressives work is the tightly packed coils, the soft ones, do almost all of the compressing under normal driving. The upper ones don't do jack till you really push the car. The way the upper ones kick in, is when the lower ones have fully compressed to the point that they're touching and essientially become just a solid cylinder, then the upper ones are forced to compress and you get the stiffer rates. What we're hearing is the lower coils touching each other, and passing on the job of compressing to the stiffer coils. This normal and unavoidable with any progressive spring, YOUR CAR IS FINE. You won't hear this noise when you take a turn harshly as the springs are pushed into each other slowly enough that you don't get the sudden engagement, you will only get it when a harsh bump pushes your springs past the extents of the softer coils suddenly. You may not get any noise at all with new springs too. This was the case for me. I'd imagine it just took some time for the springs to break in and after they softened up a bit they started to touch more often.

Anyways, I had this epiphany while reading the technobable column about air springs in the last issue of Sport Compact Car (mmmm air springs, another topic for another thread). They explained how they work there, I don't know why this didn't occur to us before but at least we know now.



Celica Forum as reference (http://www.celicasupra.com/forums/showthread.php?3040-The-lowered-mk2-front-end-CLUNK.-The-FINAL-ANSWER.)

Im trying to find as many answers to this as I can.. :(

I went to an empty parking lot... going over speed bumps slowly... with one wheel at a time.. i try the left side..

i go over the front left wheel and i hear the noise in the center to the right side....
i go over the back left wheel and i hear nothing...
i go over the front right wheel and i hear the noise in the right side...
i go over the back right wheel and i hear nothing...

But I am also hearing a lot of people say its the strut mount bolt and Front end sub-frame bushings....


I had that problem. I brought it in and told them I believe it sway bar bushings. They said after looking at it that it was the endlinks. Soo they replaced those, clunk still there.

They then replaced the struts, sway bar bushings, and control arms... the clunk went away and hasn't returned. I am pretty confident it was just the bushings that were bad but they told me they didn't want to keep having to have me come back in trying to diagnose it so they just replaced it all.

link (http://www.mazdas247.com/forum/showthread.php?123777249-MS3-Front-End-Clunk)

[marvin24k]

Hey, I got the same problem. I got a hotchkis installed by Jimmy. I get the clunk noise when going over bumps @ the front. I've gotten nowhere trying to locate the source. Please keep us up to date.

Marvin.

[cwp_sedan]

He no longer owns these so you won't get your answer from the OP.

[philipfreire]

Hey, I got the same problem. I got a hotchkis installed by Jimmy. I get the clunk noise when going over bumps @ the front. I've gotten nowhere trying to locate the source. Please keep us up to date.

Marvin.

The problem is Jimmy does not tighten the bolts with the weight of the car on all 4 wheels. He does it on a 2post lift while the wheels are hanging in suspension. once you lower the car, the wheels and sway bar sit at their normal position. What you will have to do is go underneath and tighten the endlink bolt to the swaybar.

If that doesnt solve your problem, your endlinks are shot. You will then need new ones. I would recommend Powergrid Inc. endlinks. Good stuff and adjustable!

[cwp_sedan]

The problem is Jimmy does not tighten the bolts with the weight of the car on all 4 wheels. He does it on a 2post lift while the wheels are hanging in suspension. once you lower the car, the wheels and sway bar sit at their normal position. What you will have to do is go underneath and tighten the endlink bolt to the swaybar.

If that doesnt solve your problem, your endlinks are shot. You will then need new ones. I would recommend Powergrid Inc. endlinks. Good stuff and adjustable!

Ok I stand corrected. There will be a response. :)

Seems like pretty good advice. I always heard that the rear bars were better tightened with a load on them rather than up on a hoist so I guess it makes sense with the fronts as well. I tightened my rear bar (OEM MS3) while the car was in the ground and it's never come lose. Over 2 years now running it with no issues.

[philipfreire]

yeah i didnt see his response until you commented and brought it to the top. :)

[Thrizzl3]

The problem is Jimmy does not tighten the bolts with the weight of the car on all 4 wheels. He does it on a 2post lift while the wheels are hanging in suspension. once you lower the car, the wheels and sway bar sit at their normal position. What you will have to do is go underneath and tighten the endlink bolt to the swaybar.

If that doesnt solve your problem, your endlinks are shot. You will then need new ones. I would recommend Powergrid Inc. endlinks. Good stuff and adjustable!

i will have jimmy do this if he can on tuesday...thanks white phil

[Fobio]

my front end knocking is from busted front swaybar bushings. I got new ones...will be replacing them. Endlinks could be an issue, but inspect the known points first. As much as I like the powergrids, they do cost a bit more than the swaybar bushings.

as flimsy as stock endlinks look, they do not fail easily.

[baymoe]

I ended getting rid of the hotchkis bars altogether because of the clunks. Check the bushing brackets on those front sways as they seem excessive sized. I bent two sets of brackets before getting rid of them.

Omg this thread reminded me to pickup my endlinks from Fobio.

[Atomic]

my front end knocking is from busted front swaybar bushings. I got new ones...will be replacing them. Endlinks could be an issue, but inspect the known points first. As much as I like the powergrids, they do cost a bit more than the swaybar bushings.

as flimsy as stock endlinks look, they do not fail easily.

The noise you got with your hotchkis swaybar bushing ... does it sound like that : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l3Wi4Gzw5PM&feature=player_embedded

Thanks for your help