Mazda to do away with the Rotary engine??? discuss...

[Kappa]

they have an R3 here in saint john for 25.... just stupid prices now... although it sucks that mazda is doing away with the rotary

[Booter22]

they have an R3 here in saint john for 25.... just stupid prices now... although it sucks that mazda is doing away with the rotary

.. this is new news to me, where did you hear that mazda is doing away with the rotary? they are talking about putting a larger 1.5-1.9L rotart in the new rx-9 if or when it is released.

[Scottobot]

I understand they're doing away with the RX-8, but not with the rotary.
And this is a great deal on a beautiful car.. but I'm not ready to part with my Speed3 yet. *siiigghhhh*..

[Awjvail]

they have an R3 here in saint john for 25.... just stupid prices now... although it sucks that mazda is doing away with the rotary

Is it really down to $25k already? Website is still showing higher price...
http://www.kingmazda.ca/en/usedcars/listing/details.spy?id=3553569

BTW, I wouldn't call the one at King Mazda "new"... it has quite a few kms on it... been on many many test drives.

[Jeff-TheBiz]

:hijack smiley

No, the Rotary is not going anywhere..

No, the R3 is not $25K for a new one..

So....

:OT

[B&T's 3]

The RX-8 is not for sale anymore in europe because the rotary will not meet european emmisions. Hense they are completely doing away with rotary altogether. The RX-8 scores very poorly in the Euro ENCAP safety ratings also. Not for passenger safety, but pedestrian safety. I find it surprising that people working at dealership here still don't know this info, or aren't sharing the fact, that there is no more RX-8 and definitely no follow-up vehicle in the works to the RX-8 planned

[pearl3]

No more rotary vechicle from Mazda in the future??

[Scottobot]

I understand no immediate successor to the RX8 but I also understand there's something in the works for sometime in the future.

[vinamack]

The RX-8 is not for sale anymore in europe because the rotary will not meet european emmisions. Hense they are completely doing away with rotary altogether. The RX-8 scores very poorly in the Euro ENCAP safety ratings also. Not for passenger safety, but pedestrian safety. I find it surprising that people working at dealership here still don't know this info, or aren't sharing the fact, that there is no more RX-8 and definitely no follow-up vehicle in the works to the RX-8 planned


Source? Or you are just blowing steam?

[B&T's 3]

Source? Or you are just blowing steam? auto mundial, fifth gear, top gear, and evo magazine. Do you need more?.

[Fuyuzora]

auto mundial, fifth gear, top gear, and evo magazine. Do you need more?.

http://www.mazda.com/mazdaspirit/rotary/16x/

It's slightly out of date, but the fact it's still up may mean something.

From what I recall, Mazda was working on applying the SKY-Activ tech to the Wankel rotary engine in order for rotaries to return to Europe. Time will tell, though.

* * *

EDIT: Found the news releases regarding the future of the rotary engine - looks like most came out last week, which I missed (search "Mazda rotary" in Google News). Sounds very uncertain... but I wouldn't call it dead until it Mazda formally acknowledges it doesn't intend to develop any further rotaries.

[Fuyuzora]

Good idea splitting this off from the RX-8 blowout thread.

On topic:

I don't think Mazda will permanently kill-off the Wankel engine... While their currently limited R&D budget may force them to focus all their efforts on the brand's bread-and-butter vehicles, I feel Mazda will come back to rotaries when the time is right.

I love rotaries though... Would definitely sell my MZ3 if an RX-7 in the right condition & price were to appear, and if I could nab a decent winter beater as well.

[Kappa]

lol holy crap this is what i get for not check back it was a typo btw i ment to put 35 not 25 my bad lol and yes mazda is doing away with the motor lol GOOGLE IT :)

[Mr Wilson]

Wards Auto (http://wardsauto.com/ar/mazda_rotary_road_110805/) take on it.

[AkitoI]

I would be all over the rotary motor (RX-8) if they had done forced induction... I always lusted after the 3rd gen RX-7. I just can't imagine buying a car that is that down on HP compared to the competition (ie 350z)...it may handle amazingly, but I want some grunt!

[Kappa]

boost it... enough said haha... or 20b swap ;)

[Booter22]

Would be interesting to see a release from mazda about killing the rotary. from what i gather they are working on the rx-9 but hey who am i to say... at least last year when they were taking away the tribute we knew they were working on the cx-5, so far didnt know they were removing the rx-8 from 2012 -

Jeff is there a list for the 2012 RX-8?

[Burner]

I doubt it's going away for good. It might be on the back burner for a little while but that's to be expected given what's going on in Japan.

[Mr Wilson]

Recent news,

"Automotive News is reporting that Mazda has stopped production of its RX-8 sports car due to lackluster sales and ever tighter global emissions standards. The Japanese automaker was forced to remove the model from European showrooms last year after it failed to meet emissions standards, and the company says that it simply can't justify continuing to manufacture the vehicle without sales in the old country.

According to the report, production wrapped up in Hiroshima, Japan in July, and global sales will finish up this year. While this may be the end for the rotary sports car in the near-term, Mazda has made it clear that the manufacturer isn't giving up on its rotary heritage any time soon."

[Mr Wilson]

Update;

"In the soap opera saga of are they or aren't they still developing a rotary engine, Mazda seems to have indicated the affirmative. According to a translation of a Tweet from Mazda PR posted on a Japanese car blog, a "new model with a next-generation rotary engine" is in development.

While there's only so much to be gleaned from a single 140-character message – even in information-dense Japanese – this forthcoming vehicle will incorporate Mazda's fuel-saving SkyActiv technologies, which is only logical. Being thirsty has long been the Achilles heel of the Wankel, and anything that can help boost mileage and cut emissions should be well-received in a successor to the discontinued RX-8."

[Fuyuzora]

"In the soap opera saga of are they or aren't they still developing a rotary engine, Mazda seems to have indicated the affirmative. According to a translation of a Tweet from Mazda PR posted on a Japanese car blog, a "new model with a next-generation rotary engine" is in development.

:like :like :like

:D

<3 Rotaries

[boyracer]

I'm confused... so, is the rotary engine in a new stage of development or is it being scrapped? This article says that it's being axed

http://news.yahoo.com/mazda-stop-mak...073644418.html
http://news.yahoo.com/mazda-stop-making-rotary-engine-vehicles-073644418.html

[Fuyuzora]

I'm confused... so, is the rotary engine in a new stage of development or is it being scrapped? This article says that it's being axed

http://news.yahoo.com/mazda-stop-mak...073644418.html
http://news.yahoo.com/mazda-stop-making-rotary-engine-vehicles-073644418.html

Malformed link. At any rate, the story trieub posted, while a nice read, didn't really say anything that we didn't know six months ago - that Mazda would not have a replacement RX vehicle ready when the RX-8 ceased production.

The next-gen rotary they've been working on is (last I heard) the "16X" rotary engine... Given Mazda's need to find stability and income following its separation from Ford though, the development of the 16X is not a priority for Mazda.

It may be a while yet before the rotary returns, but I have little doubt it will... Eventually...

[cwp_sedan]

Fixed link

http://news.yahoo.com/mazda-stop-making-rotary-engine-vehicles-073644418.html

[Fuman]

a new rotary engine is under development
http://carscoop.blogspot.com/2011/10/mazda-pr-tweets-that-company-is-working.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+Carscoop+%28CARSCOOP%29

[Fuyuzora]

The bronze R3s on the end-of-the-run Spirit R RX-8 are sexy... Would go great with my gunmetal blue... :drool

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-4pgTkLHnvJI/To9yxRaQR8I/AAAAAAAFLTQ/sf4Ic0nRPmk/s800/MAZDA-RX-8-SPIRIT-R-0.jpg

http://carscoop.blogspot.com/2011/10/mazda-bids-farewell-to-rx-8-with-japan.html

[Fuyuzora]

Merging this in from the other thread...


they should have done more R&D. a 1.3liter pushing that much power... its like a large pop bottle running your car and making it go decently fast...

Rotary engines are not like reciprocating engines. In a reciprocating engine, each piston has to undergo four motions (intake, compression, combustion, exhaust) and each piston can only perform one at a time. Each rotor in a rotary engine however, may perform multiple stages simultaneously due to its multiple faces. While a reciprocating engine only undergoes one power stroke for each four motions, a rotary engine will undergo three power strokes per full rotor rotation (one stroke per rotor face). As a rule of thumb, the "piston-equivalent" displacement of a rotary engine is equal to around 1.5 to 2 times its actual displacement.

This means a 1.3 litre rotary (like the 13B-REW) is equal to a 2 ~ 2.6 litre reciprocating engine.

And it does this while also being more compact and lighter than a conventional engine.

<3 Wankel rotary engines.

[CanadianReaper]

Why is the 1.3 rotary such a gas hog then in the RX8? Also it is quite low on hp compared to other sport coupe competitors.

[Fuyuzora]

Why is the 1.3 rotary such a gas hog then in the RX8? Also it is quite low on hp compared to other sport coupe competitors.

... Because it's a Wankel rotary engine.

They make high power for their displacement because of the simultaneous performance of multiple phases of combustion, but that doesn't mean they'll have good fuel economy.

[Kiyomi]

... Because it's a Wankel rotary engine.

They make high power for their displacement because of the simultaneous performance of multiple phases of combustion, but that doesn't mean they'll have good fuel economy.

which is why they should do more r&d instead of throwing it out.... i actually watched a vid for 10 minutes on how this motor works and its quite interesting. :D sooo much potential...

[Fuyuzora]

which is why they should do more r&d instead of throwing it out.... i actually watched a vid for 10 minutes on how this motor works and its quite interesting. :D sooo much potential...

If you read back a bit through this thread, you'll see I am a huge fan of rotaries. :D

I agree they should definitely keep up the R&D, although I understand a hiatus for a few years may be necessary for Mazda to get its finances in order and concentrate on its core business. :thumbsup

[Mr Wilson]

Mazda is saying “peace out” to their V6 engines. The party line is that they don’t really fit with the companies new philosophy, and the SkyACTIV portfolio. Instead, the company is drumming up a few alternatives.

The V6 engines used in the Mazda6 and CX-9 were fine, but nobody will shed a tear over their demise. According to a Car and Driver interview with Mazda USA Senior VP Robert Davis, the new Mazda6 will use SkyACTIV 4-cylinder engines only (hopefully the SkyACTIV-D diesel will be offered – a hybrid is rumored as well), while the next-generation CX-9 will apparently use some kind of 4-cylinder with forced induction.

In more performance oriented news, Mazda is working on not one but two new rotary engines. A new, more efficient, more powerful rotary engine as well as a rotary designed to be used as a range extender for an electric vehicle. The light weight of the rotary would be a plus for this application, while the lack of torque would be rendered moot by the electric motor.

And finally, news of the next MX-5 remains the same. It will be lighter and follow the same principles as SkyACTIV; less mass, more efficiency. And Davis hinted that there would be some more radical special editions in the spirit of the MX-5 Spyder or MX-5 Super 20.

Click for link (http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2012/04/mazda-says-deuces-to-v6-engines-welcomes-rotaries-back-into-the-fold/)


When premium carmakers such as BMW and Audi put so much focus on their four-cylinder powerplants, it's only reasonable that mainstream brands like Mazda do the same.

Currently, the Japanese carmakers offers a larger V6 engine on its Mazda6 sedan and CX-9 crossover, but that won't be the case with their successors. Speaking to Car & Driver magazine, Robert Davis, Mazda’s senior vice president of U.S. Operations, told the publication that it has no plans to develop a next generation V6 under it SkyActive program.

Instead, it will focus on making its larger cars lighter and offer turbocharged versions of its four-cylinder engines.

Davis was also asked about the future of Mazda's Rotary engine. According to the Mazda official, the company will continue its development applying the same core technologies found in other SkyActive products including more-efficient transmissions. He added that Mazda is also exploring the idea of using a new rotary engine as an electric generator.

When asked about the next generation of the popular MX-5 / Miata, Davis said that it too will benefit from the firm's SkyActive program and that it will be lighter than the current model. In addition, he said that the company is preparing some very special editions of the compact roadster model.

Click for link (http://carscoop.blogspot.com/2012/04/mazda-to-discard-v6-engine-plans-to.html)

[Elusivellama]

^ I'm interested to hear more news about the turbo 4 bangers under the SkyActiv moniker.

[MarkWB]

A turbo 4 banger in a CX-9? Anyone else seeing high mileage problems in the future of this concept?

[Kappa]

i swear to god i never started this thread... wtf?

[The Wolf]

:mod power smiley

[Mr Wilson]

Mazda’s MX-5 Guru Reveals Details On The Next RX-7

http://images.thetruthaboutcars.com/2012/10/Mazda-RX-7-FD-450x228.jpg

'Putting an end to the vicious cycle of rumors and conjecture, Mazda’s sports car chief revealed that they will bring back the RX-7 in 2017, to coincide with the 50th anniversary of the Cosmo sports car.

Nobohiru Yamamoto, who is now head of the MX-5 program, told Australia’s The Motor Report that the RX-7 will use a stretched version of the Miata platform, and weigh roughly as much as the 2775 lb Toyota 86. Japanese market versions will have a small rear seat, while North American versions will be two-seaters.

Power will come from the new 16X rotary engine, a naturally aspirated unit capable of nearly 300 horsepower. Yamamoto said that a large single turbo caused too much lag, and a sequential twin-turbo setup like the previous RX-7 was “not ideal”. But Yamamoto didn’t rule out a turbo either for future production. But even in naturally aspirated form, the power to weight ratio should exceed the last RX-7 sold in North America.

Also absent from the RX-7 will be any kind of KERS or hybrid system. Mazda currently doesn’t have any sort of technology in that space, and according to Yamamoto “”…a pure sports ca…must be internal combustion.” Lightweight aluminum body panels and special catalysts will help the car meet tough emissions and fuel economy standards.

Unfortunately, all that will come at a price. The RX-7 will apparently be more expensive than something like a Nissan 370Z or a Toyota 86. All that engineering comes at a price, and the RX-7 will be positioned to reflect that.'

mazdas-mx-5-guru-reveals-details-on-the-next-rx-7 (http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2012/10/mazdas-mx-5-guru-reveals-details-on-the-next-rx-7/)

[The Wolf]

300 hp NA rotary? Yes please. That is right up my alley.

[Booter22]

i heard the rx9 ( shinari ) will be coming around 2015 with a new rotary.. guess we will have to see when we get there.

[Genpu_Mz3]

From Wikipedia:

The next generation rotary engine, dubbed "16X," is currently under development.[11] Rumours suggest that the RX-8 may be replaced by a new smaller, lighter, simpler sports car set to compete with the likes of the Toyota 86. Mazda’s new 16X rotary engine is rumored to be at the heart of the RX-8 successor. Rumors suggest the RX-8 successor will include the introduction of direct injection technology, as well as aluminium side housings with 1600 cc capacity instead of 1308 cc of the 13B (RX-7 and RX-8) engine. Rumors also suggest that the new engine dimensions of the 16X will have increased stroke and reduced rotor width for improved thermal efficiency and more torque. Japanese reports and Autocar both claim that the next generation RX-8 will have around 290 horsepower. They also claim the car should weigh in at around 2,800 lb (1,300 kg), making it a true light-weight sports car.
Rumors suggest that development work on the next generation rotary engine have been given a lower priority and will proceed at a slower pace, due to limited engineering resources and tightening emission regulations, making development of a high performance rotary engine a lower priority compared to the next generation MX-5. However, in a press release on February 2012 Mazda stressed that development of rotary engines will continue, but stopped short of revealing any further commitments. Takashi Yamanouchi, Mazda's Representative Director, Chairman of the Board, President and CEO "...Although RX-8 production is ending, the rotary engine will always represent the spirit of Mazda and Mazda remains committed to its ongoing development." [12]
The sales of the RX-8 ended in 2010 in Europe after failing emission standards.[13]
The production of the RX-8 ended in April 2012 in Japan. Mazda had produced 192,094[8] RX-8s since 2003.
The production of the last rotary engine ended in June 21st, 2012 followed by the end of RX-8 assembly on June 22nd, 2012 at Mazda's Ujina, Hiroshima plant

[eSS]

I've heard plenty of news/rumors about the next upcoming rotary powered car from mazda. The "16X" seems to be the popular one. Also heard there's a skyactiv one being produced along with hydrogen and electric as I've heard the rotary works quite well with that kind of set up. Hoping they improve gas mileage

[Aitch]

If its more expensive than a 370z with only 300hp, it will immediately suffer the same fate as the last RX7 - poor sales and a premature death. Such a car would need to be positioned against the Genesis Coupe in price.

[Booter22]

so... as i was at mazda canada yesterday and heard they had the New 6 and the next gen 3 there.. i wasnt able to go see it :( and i heard the dealer owners that were allowed to go see couldnt even bring there phones with them. as there was some other next gen stuff in there as well.. but i did talk to my dealer rep about the rotary and if the shinari or RX9 would be coming out in 2015 as rumored. from the conversation it seems that Mazda is looking into alternatitive fuels.. and what it sounds like.. this is going to possibly be in the next gen RX

http://www.mazda.com/mazdaspirit/rotary/hre/about/index.html

but we will just need to wait and see.

[eSS]

There's a couple videos on YouTube of the hydrogen rx8. I thinks it's in Poland or somewhere in the video it said that they have hydrogen re fueling stations. Ill post the link when I'm not on my phone

From the video, It has its advantages such as being able to run on full hydrogen by the push of a button and small quirks such as having 2 fuel doors. One major downside was the actual tank took up the whole trunk. Looking forward to see where mazda goes with this. I promised myself my next car will be rotary powered