Lucic hit on Miller, opinions?

[GWN]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4rYgKqDMB9Q

what do you think? should Lucic have been suspended?

[Fuyuzora]

Not a big hockey guy, so please correct me if I am wrong but - as I understand it, when they goalie leaves the crease, they are treated as if they were a defenceman? Also, AFAIK that would have been an entirely non-unusual hit if it had been anyone other than Miller on the receiving end?

If yes to both of the above... Then no, Miller should have stayed put in the crease if he didn't want to risk getting hit.

If no to either/both, then yeah Lucic probably should have been suspended.

[coriolis]

Not a big hockey guy, so please correct me if I am wrong but - as I understand it, when they goalie leaves the crease, they are treated as if they were a defenceman? Also, AFAIK that would have been an entirely non-unusual hit if it had been anyone other than Miller on the receiving end?

If yes to both of the above... Then no, Miller should have stayed put in the crease if he didn't want to risk getting hit.

If no to either/both, then yeah Lucic probably should have been suspended.

Yes, but it does not mean you have free reign to plow over goalies.

I just hope Miller's okay, a concussion would be horrible.


edit: Personally I would of preferred a suspension. Many say Lucic did it on purpose cause he knew no Sabres would even retaliate, which as predicted, happened.

[GWN]

The Sabres have since confirmed Miller has a concussion, and will be out indefinitely.

Being a Bruins fan and a hockey player, I'm on the fence. Miller shouldn't have been out that far from his crease in the first place, but is there a way Lucic could have avoided the hit entirely (while still skating to play the puck)?

And Miller's retaliation is something that seems to get no notice at all, he swung his stick like a sword! That would have been a serious injury if it had connected with Lucic's knees

[Hoodzy]

Looks legit to me.. however I know nothing about hockey.

[boyracer]

There used to be an unwritten rule amongst hockey players that you don't run the other teams goalie, you can give him a light bump but you can't plow him over. Even though the goaltender has more equipment he is still more vulnerable then the other players (the larger equipment restricts his mobility) so the chance of landing awkwardly is more susceptible. But as for the question should Lucic have been suspended? Tough one to answer, looks like a clean hit at first glance (looks like he used his forearms), but one could argue that Lucic got his elbows up and was head hunting Miller.

[mazda_gurl]

Given that this is the 2nd take out by a Bruins player, yes, he should have been suspended.

And there was nothing clean about that hit - he had plenty of time to stop or move out of the way. I dont think it was deliberate. But I do think that he tried to rile the other team up by rattling the goalie. Only he didnt realize at his speed how hard the hit would be.

[boyracer]

He didn't run him from behind, or leave his skates. Lucic followed through with his check, if it wasn't a goalie but another player we wouldn't be having this conversation. The only thing that can constitute this as a "dirty hit" is did Lucic use his elbows to hit Miller in the head. That's it. Almost all hits the player has enough time to stop, but we are taught to follow through (within a reasonable distance) and Lucic was well inside that reasonable distance.

EDIT After watching the video over & over again & different angles, it's a clean hit. Lucic was racing for the puck, Miller came out to play it (Miller knew what was coming, at the last second he tried to brace himself for the hit). Lucic didn't use his elbows and got Miller straight on the shoulder.

[vinnierap]

He definately should have been suspended. That is a DIRTY ass play, and they need to take shit like that outta the game. Dont get me wrong, I am all for fighting and hitting in hockey. But players who intentially try to hurt someone should be penalized for it.

[07carbon3]

brendan shanahan is a moron, lucic should have a suspension period. that hit was totally intentional, you can see how he puts his shoulder into it

[peterm15]

It's a little fishy.

On one hand miller didn't deserve to be hit like that, if you pay attention to a short portion of the clip it seems like a headshot.

On the other hand miller was WAY out and lucic had his head down racing for the puck. Probably didn't see him until it was to late, and was protecting his own head.

To me it seems like miller was trying to pull a penalty and deserved to be plowed. BUT, head shot suspensions have been given out for less this year.

This to my knowledge is the second goalie with " whiplash like symptoms" ( lol) this year. IMO the hit on Riemer was more deliberate than the one on muller

[GWN]

That's what I think as well! Reimer's hit was way worse (in my opinion)

Miller was too far out of his net, he had to know someone would be chasing the puck down, it's the NHL.
I might go so for as to say Miller is almost as much at fault as Lucic.

That said, Miller is one of my favourite goalies, but I lost a little respect for him seeing the way he responded to the hit.

[peterm15]

The response killed me to. That's just completely unprofessional.
Thats one compliment I'll give to Wilson and Burke. Their players will not get away with that. Scrivens was given a good warning and banned from talking to the press after saying he thought he was playing well in net one night.

[The Wolf]

the NHL doesn't seem very clear about how a goaltender is to be treated when he wanders outside of his crease. Personally, I'd like to see them treated like a defenceman if they have both skates outside the crease or the trapezoidal area behind the net.

[Strongjag]

As a former major junior ref I'll post my big schpiel in the morning but I say no suspension, but should have been a 5 at least (thinking 5 plus game).

[zoso]

No suspension, Goalie leaves his haven of the crease then he'll get treated like any other player. It's a follow through it. what if lucic managed to block the puck with the follow through then it would be an open goal.

On the flip side they should make hits like the one Thomas made last season where he checked players while in his crease and they were not illegal and given him a penalty.

After rewatching it esp the alternate angle you can see He did let up but had no time to stop and at that point trying to stop could have made both of the fall awkwardly or be a knee on knee hot collision by time miller played the puck the safest thing lucic could have done was do a full body on body else risk a major injury. look at him he pulls back his body and braces for a hit, he doesn't lead into it in any way.

I think miller should have been suspended for that Stick swing after he go hit tho, thats just irresponsible and dangerous

[Leafs_Nation87]

Lucic didn't exactly try and move out of the way of Miller but Miller left the crease and tried to get the puck....Fair game...its unfortunate Miller got a concussion.....wrong person to try and chase a puck against. Tough call to make for NHL

[boyracer]

As a former major junior ref I'll post my big schpiel in the morning but I say no suspension, but should have been a 5 at least (thinking 5 plus game).


No suspension, Goalie leaves his haven of the crease then he'll get treated like any other player. It's a follow through it. what if lucic managed to block the puck with the follow through then it would be an open goal.

On the flip side they should make hits like the one Thomas made last season where he checked players while in his crease and they were not illegal and given him a penalty.

After rewatching it esp the alternate angle you can see He did let up but had no time to stop and at that point trying to stop could have made both of the fall awkwardly or be a knee on knee hot collision by time miller played the puck the safest thing lucic could have done was do a full body on body else risk a major injury. look at him he pulls back his body and braces for a hit, he doesn't lead into it in any way.

I think miller should have been suspended for that Stick swing after he go hit tho, thats just irresponsible and dangerous

Thank you.... I can't wait to hear it from a ref's point of view, though I have a feeling I know most of the points.... funny how that swing from Miller, no one talks about it. For a second I thought Miller was Billy Smith. Smith used to think he was a lumber jack with an axe cutting down trees back in the '80's

[coriolis]

The slash was pretty big but seriously, I'd think it would be a bigger deal for a concussion which may never go away, then broken shins. Players have padding for their limbs, goalies have helmets but it still does not completely protect the brain and its fluids during a hit like this.



Concussions are serious things, even a simple collision can have painful outcomes down the line.


Lets just hope for the sake of Team USA that Miller fully recovers, or else they're screwed for the next Olympics!

[queens49]

The slash was pretty big but seriously, I'd think it would be a bigger deal for a concussion which may never go away, then broken shins. Players have padding for their limbs, goalies have helmets but it still does not completely protect the brain and its fluids during a hit like this.



Concussions are serious things, even a simple collision can have painful outcomes down the line.


Lets just hope for the sake of Team USA that Miller fully recovers, or else they're screwed for the next Olympics!

Based on that, all hitting should be removed from the game. No helmet out there protects players brains from bouncing around from hits. I've seen way harder open ice hits that completely levels the player. Nobody talks about suspending the player who dished out the hit, they mainly say that was a good open ice it. If a goalie wants to wander out of their crease, than they should get hit like everybody else. Lucic would of had a great scoring chance, but Miller took it away by going out of the crease that far.

[SilentJay]

When you charge out of your crease in a foot race against an opposing player that you KNOW is coming towards you, you should be well aware of the consequences. Not saying that what Lucic did was completely right but granting a goalie absolute immunity from physical contact outside the crease is ridiculous.

Might as well have a defenceman stay in net and send the goalie on a breakaway.

[coriolis]

Based on that, all hitting should be removed from the game. No helmet out there protects players brains from bouncing around from hits. I've seen way harder open ice hits that completely levels the player. Nobody talks about suspending the player who dished out the hit, they mainly say that was a good open ice it. If a goalie wants to wander out of their crease, than they should get hit like everybody else. Lucic would of had a great scoring chance, but Miller took it away by going out of the crease that far.

Fair enough, perhaps the fact I play goal might have created my own bias towards it. It is a grey area, and it makes sense why it is. Yes the goalie should not be untouchable, but you have to draw a line somewhere when someone who has 50lbs+ on another player.

[Soulsofmischief]

He definately should have been suspended. That is a DIRTY ass play, and they need to take shit like that outta the game. Dont get me wrong, I am all for fighting and hitting in hockey. But players who intentially try to hurt someone should be penalized for it.


IMHO there is nothing wrong with this hit, Goalies have their sacred area where they cant be touched and all rules benefit them, its called the crease, as soon as you leave it then too frickin bad, he made the decision to go for what seemed to be a 50/50 puck (even at 60/40 you have to be able to accept the consequences of that kind of challenge )

that being said.. the truth is that the violence in Hockey is absolutely BS , it adds NOTHING to the skill of players and the enjoyment of the game, in football for instance the point is to tackle the player so the violent nature of hitting them is part of the actual objective, in Hockey it was probably added by the less skilled players trying to find a way ( a dirty one ) to better keep up with the good players.

and as for Fighting? lmao.. its pathetic. illegal in everyday life and yet somehow assault is legit when its on ice and there are 18000 people present.

[vinnierap]

So I just watched and re-watched the video. Lucic definately could have turned and avoided the collision. If you pay attention to the video you see Lucic put his arms up and after the hit his arms are extended fully, showing that the hit was intentional and not just a "collsion". I dont think its right that a player coming full force should hit a goalie like that.

And yes Millers reaction of swinging the stick was extremely dangerous, but he was reacting to the hit out of anger and did not hit anyone (luckily).

I still think that Lucic should have been suspended!

[seelsy]

I'm a goalie as well, and ive taken my fair share of bumps on the ice. I'm a fairly solid skater so only one time out of I'd say 5 have I ever been run over similar to this situation, usually due to my gear I get the advantage in a head to head hit. And i completely agree that when we wonder out to play the puck we are now a member of the play and should be susceptible to be hit by an opposing player. But in this circumstance, lucic knew he wasn't getting the puck, so he lifts up once he reaches the top of the circle to go for the hit. I don't think there should of been a suspension, but someone should have fought after the hit. Anytime I've ever been hit, that player would be bloody before heading to the box if you hit a teams goalie. Its one of those unwritten rules in hockey, like if you play a team with a female player. Yes she may be just as tough as the guys, she may even have more skill than every guy out there, but if you hit her, you're getting dummied by someone. Same thing should have happened here. Shame on the sabres for not doing standing up for their goalie.

[Cush29]

As a goalie, and someone who has played hockey his whole life (goal and out) I"ll chime in.

Hit was dirty and against the rules. Anyone who says or believed goalies are "fair game" or "just like any other player" as soon as they leave the crease are dead wrong - check the rule book, it clearly states contact with the goalie is not permitted anywhere in our out of the crease.

Lucic is a player who plays a moderately dirty game, he followed through with his hands and elbows and was fully aware of what the end result would be as well as essentially bragged about it after the game and stated if it had happed to his goalie the reaction from his team would have been much different and they wouldn't have allowed it - so he essentially knew it was wrong both via the rule book as well as the unwritten rules of hockey.

He made no attempt to miss Miller, he had ample opportunity to do so and instead just ran him over, that's the problem with hockey these days - everyone is a tough guy with a visor (or in my league the 'toughest guys' are the tools with a full cage on who chirp, slash and challenge guys to a fight....morons) and runs the goalies, crashes the crease with zero consequences.

As far as Miller's attempted slash, it was one handed and weak at best and failed to make contact so what would you give him a peanalty for "attempted slash"?

I have zero respect for Lucic for the hit but more so for his comments after the fact, essentially saying he knew it was wrong but didn't care.

Buffalo's lack of a physical reaction was embarrassing to say the least.!

[coriolis]

The thing about the lack of Sabre's reaction was, who would step up? Look at Boston's lineup, they have plenty of tough guys who can lay the body and fight.


Who does the Sabres have?

This is one of the main points of why this happened. Lucic had the opportunity and probably the mindset to avoid Miller out of respect. But he didn't because he knew the Sabres would not do anything, and if they did, they could easily handle it.

[Soulsofmischief]

As a goalie, and someone who has played hockey his whole life (goal and out) I"ll chime in.

Hit was dirty and against the rules. Anyone who says or believed goalies are "fair game" or "just like any other player" as soon as they leave the crease are dead wrong - check the rule book, it clearly states contact with the goalie is not permitted anywhere in our out of the crease.

Lucic is a player who plays a moderately dirty game, he followed through with his hands and elbows and was fully aware of what the end result would be as well as essentially bragged about it after the game and stated if it had happed to his goalie the reaction from his team would have been much different and they wouldn't have allowed it - so he essentially knew it was wrong both via the rule book as well as the unwritten rules of hockey.

He made no attempt to miss Miller, he had ample opportunity to do so and instead just ran him over, that's the problem with hockey these days - everyone is a tough guy with a visor (or in my league the 'toughest guys' are the tools with a full cage on who chirp, slash and challenge guys to a fight....morons) and runs the goalies, crashes the crease with zero consequences.

As far as Miller's attempted slash, it was one handed and weak at best and failed to make contact so what would you give him a peanalty for "attempted slash"?

I have zero respect for Lucic for the hit but more so for his comments after the fact, essentially saying he knew it was wrong but didn't care.

Buffalo's lack of a physical reaction was embarrassing to say the least.!


if thats the case then checking in general should be banned from hockey.. " Charging shall mean the actions of a player who, as a result of distance traveled, shall violently check an opponent in any manner. A “charge” may be the result of a check into the boards, into the goal frame or in open ice."

and if you want to get into the definition of a distance traveled please lets not get into semantics about that.. cause we could also get into what's a reasonable attempt to avoid the hit, for the record i dont think Lucic made much if any to avoid it, but the instance you get into interpretations then you get these discussions lol.

if you want checking and physical play then people are going to get checked and get roughed up.

[seelsy]

if thats the case then checking in general should be banned from hockey.. " Charging shall mean the actions of a player who, as a result of distance traveled, shall violently check an opponent in any manner. A “charge” may be the result of a check into the boards, into the goal frame or in open ice."

and if you want to get into the definition of a distance traveled please lets not get into semantics about that.. cause we could also get into what's a reasonable attempt to avoid the hit, for the record i dont think Lucic made much if any to avoid it, but the instance you get into interpretations then you get these discussions lol.

if you want checking and physical play then people are going to get checked and get roughed up.

of course guys are gonna get roughed up, its why we love this game. But the fact in this case is that lucic's hit did nothing for the play. The puck was already cleared, he had plenty of time to side step and avoid the hit. However, he took the hit with the intention to cause harm. It didn't free the puck up or give him the opportunity to knock the puck away, the hit had melicous purposes, which is why i said someone should have fought him. Whether or not you have a chance of losing shouldn't have made a difference. If you hit a teams goalie, you should pay for it. Sabres need to grow a set and throw a hand or two.

[The Wolf]

^I really don't feel like he did have time to get out of a collision path on the play. To me, it looks like he was standing nearly vertical at the point of impact, whereas if he was going for a hit, he would have been leading with his shoulder. He did follow through though. To me, on a play like that where it's a race to the puck, should be fair game.

[coriolis]

These are the players with the most PIMs, though fighters not so much. I removed Thomas Vanek and put in Stafford cause, well, Vanek......lol

Patrick Kaleta
Paul Gaustad
Cody McCormick
Drew Stafford

Shawn Thornton
Zdeno Chara
Milan Lucic
Adam McQuaid

Yeahhh, any fights would just be just the Bruins ragdolling and embarassing the Sabres.

[-RJ3-]

I havent seen this video but lately this year goalies have been abused more often than last.

I really have to blame NHL12 hahaah

But I still detest Gionta for the hit he did on Reimer.. Deliberate or not I am not convinced.

Miller hearing he gets a concussion gives him more string of bad luck this season.. I had to remove him from my pool as he wasnt playing well.

I think it is true that a goalie has the right to be out of his crease and be aware of his surroundings.. If a goalie gets tripped outside of his crease it is fair game but if he gets checked in which he falls down this should be goalie interference.

if he is hit from behind deliberately id call this a suspension.

[rktsci]

I'm of the opinion that if the goalie is out of the crease/trapezoid then he is fair game as long as its clean. This one was really on the line and I don't think you can suspend a player if the call is borderline.

[midnightfxgt]

Player should have been suspended. He broke the rules, and injured another player doing so.

Goalies are NOT fair game outside of their crease folks. Its in the rulebook :)

[seelsy]

^I really don't feel like he did have time to get out of a collision path on the play. To me, it looks like he was standing nearly vertical at the point of impact, whereas if he was going for a hit, he would have been leading with his shoulder. He did follow through though. To me, on a play like that where it's a race to the puck, should be fair game.

of course he had time, these guys are professional hockey players who know how to skate and can change direction almost instantly. He looked up as miller played the puck, when he was at the top of the circle, He hit miller between the face off dot and the bottom of the circle, more than ample time to side step the hit and get back into the play. You can even see from the video he stopped his stride in order to set up the hit to miller.

[GWN]

A goalkeeper is not “fair game” just because he is outside the goal crease. The appropriate penalty should be assessed in every case where an attacking player makes unnecessary contact with the goalkeeper. However, incidental contact will be permitted when the goalkeeper is in the act of playing the puck outside his goal crease provided the attacking player has made a reasonable effort to avoid such unnecessary contact.


Rule 69.4

The only question, I suppose, is whether or not Lucic made resonable effort to avoid contact

[Soulsofmischief]

Rule 69.4

The only question, I suppose, is whether or not Lucic made resonable effort to avoid contact

again we get into interpretations.. so we could argue this forever. and as that is said before if you put up the charging rule than you could very likely say that checking is not legit in hockey.

[seelsy]

again we get into interpretations.. so we could argue this forever. and as that is said before if you put up the charging rule than you could very likely say that checking is not legit in hockey.

not really, the charging rule just like rule 69.4 are pretty cut and dry. The player can not initiate contact with a goalie in or out of their crease. If contact does occur, the player has to have made an attempt to get out of the way and avoid it. Which lucic did not.

[greatwhiteshark]

Yea to what everyone said, it was dirty and avoidable. Don't mess with the goalie! Lucic should try stick handling...

[Soulsofmischief]

not really, the charging rule just like rule 69.4 are pretty cut and dry. The player can not initiate contact with a goalie in or out of their crease. If contact does occur, the player has to have made an attempt to get out of the way and avoid it. Which lucic did not.

i beg to differ using the word "reasonable" leaves it completely open to interpretation to some the fact that he didnt put his shoulder down grit his teeth and absolutely level Miller was Reasonable attempt. so its not cut and dry at all.

[seelsy]

i beg to differ using the word "reasonable" leaves it completely open to interpretation to some the fact that he didnt put his shoulder down grit his teeth and absolutely level Miller was Reasonable attempt. so its not cut and dry at all.

maybe to weekend hockey fans, but people who know hockey know what a reasonable attempt is. Even a side step to lucic's left would be something I'd consider reasonable. However, once he saw the puck was played, he stopped his stride, stood up, and went right into miller. By watching the video clip, its very cut and dry in this case.

[Soulsofmischief]

maybe to weekend hockey fans, but people who know hockey know what a reasonable attempt is. Even a side step to lucic's left would be something I'd consider reasonable. However, once he saw the puck was played, he stopped his stride, stood up, and went right into miller. By watching the video clip, its very cut and dry in this case.

lmao.. we could do this forever.. define " weekend fan "

[seelsy]

lmao.. we could do this forever.. define " weekend fan "

Everyone knows a weekend fan lol your buddy who comes over, watches hockey night in Canada on Saturday night, yells at the refs, gives you his interpretation on why that last call was bogus yet has no idea what hes talking about, and mispronounces every players name. Now don't get me wrong, im not calling you a weekend hockey fan, im just describing a type haha. But regardless this is all just opinion, from a goalies mindset, and playing some fairly high level hockey, i know lucic's actions did not reflect a reasonable attempt to get out the way, this is all im saying.

[The Wolf]

Lol, I suppose Brendan Shanahan is a weekend hockey fan then. He didn't think it was a suspendable offense.

Perhaps somebody with good knowledge of the game ought to call him up and explain some things.

[SirWanker]

It was a questionable hit but if you look at the replay @ 0.59 minute mark, Miller's bare head bounced off the ice rather hard. Methinks this was likely the cause of his concussion and not entirely from the hit.

[seelsy]

Lol, I suppose Brendan Shanahan is a weekend hockey fan then. He didn't think it was a suspendable offense.

Perhaps somebody with good knowledge of the game ought to call him up and explain some things.

Brendan Shanahan has also been grilled by the majority of the 30 GM's at a conference yesterday who felt it was a suspendible offense. League wants to take a stronger stances against running goalies. So yes, i believe Shanahan should have taken a better look at it, however, in his position not everyone is going to agree with his decisions. This is one of those decisions that a lot of people don't agree with.

[seelsy]

after learning that about two-thirds of GMs would have preferred to see a suspension in the Lucic-Miller case, NHL disciplinarian Brendan Shanahan acknowledged that his mandate had been altered.

"I think there's certainly a very heightened sensitivity to the goalies and the future of all the goalies in this league," he said following Tuesday's meeting. "Certainly they're not fair game. I think that players have to understand that. The general managers expressed to me the importance of all the players on the ice but also the extreme importance of the goaltender in that position."

Straight from Shanahan's mouth directly

[RedRaptor]

Lucic is a dirty player and always been. He's got stone hands and the only reason he's in the NHL is for his size (can't be for his skating since he claims he couldn't stop to avoid Miller). In a few years when age catches up to him, he'll be a dinosaur with no skill set.

I have to give him props for selling it to Brendan on how he couldn't avoid Miller.

The Sabres should have targetted Lucic for the rest of the game. Sure you're not as big as him, but skate by him with an elbow up or something to prove a point.

[Cush29]

if thats the case then checking in general should be banned from hockey.. " Charging shall mean the actions of a player who, as a result of distance traveled, shall violently check an opponent in any manner. A “charge” may be the result of a check into the boards, into the goal frame or in open ice."

and if you want to get into the definition of a distance traveled please lets not get into semantics about that.. cause we could also get into what's a reasonable attempt to avoid the hit, for the record i dont think Lucic made much if any to avoid it, but the instance you get into interpretations then you get these discussions lol.

if you want checking and physical play then people are going to get checked and get roughed up.

So you think Charging is the same as a body check? Anyone who has played hockey knows the difference between a charge and a clean body check. That's like saying walking is the same as running because your moving forward in both situaitons. It's not about semantics at all, not only did he not make a reasonable attempt to avoid hitting Miller when he realized he was not going to win the race to the puck but he in fact made no attempt - hence the peanalty call.

Lots of talk on the sports shows about the NHL possible looking at a rule change to protect goalies similar to the rules in football protecting QB's.

Guess we'll have to wait and see but from what I've read / hear from the consensus of the GM's and even Shanny himself if that same play happened tomorrow (when it happens or something similar happens later in the year) there will be a suspension. Watch and see.

Gionta's "accidential" elbow on Reimer was deliberate and avoidable as well in my opinion and who knows how long it'll cost the Leafs their starter for.........brutal.

[The Wolf]

the difference is that in the NFL, of the qb leaves the pocket*, the special rules protecting him go out the window. Sure you're more likely to get unneccesary roughness, but the qb takes that risk when he leaves the pocket (or his "crease")

I'm definitely for protecting goaltenders, but they should not have immunity when they're playing as a defenceman. But then again, that will never happen.

*My bad, meant to say that if the quarterback tucks the ball to run, he's no longer a "passer" and no special protection is afforded him.

I honestly think they should
A) remove trapezoid
B) goaltender is 100% protected in his crease and behind the icing line, treated as a defenceman everywhere else.

[Soulsofmischief]

the difference is that in the NFL, of the qb leaves the pocket, the special rules protecting him go out the window. Sure you're more likely to get unneccesary roughness, but the an takes that risk when he leaves the pocket (or his "crease")

I'm definitely for protecting goaltenders, but they should not have immunity when they're playing as a defenceman. But then again, that will never happen.


+1 exactly what i mean..


So you think Charging is the same as a body check? Anyone who has played hockey knows the difference between a charge and a clean body check. That's like saying walking is the same as running because your moving forward in both situaitons. It's not about semantics at all, not only did he not make a reasonable attempt to avoid hitting Miller when he realized he was not going to win the race to the puck but he in fact made no attempt - hence the peanalty call.

Lots of talk on the sports shows about the NHL possible looking at a rule change to protect goalies similar to the rules in football protecting QB's.

Guess we'll have to wait and see but from what I've read / hear from the consensus of the GM's and even Shanny himself if that same play happened tomorrow (when it happens or something similar happens later in the year) there will be a suspension. Watch and see.

Gionta's "accidential" elbow on Reimer was deliberate and avoidable as well in my opinion and who knows how long it'll cost the Leafs their starter for.........brutal.

wait are you telling me there is some sort of soft gentle checking going on in the NHL going on that im not aware of ? Maybe with pillows? seriously, everyone takes good drive into them, see thats the point of a body check to rattle someone not to gently caress them as you whisper " nice goal first period pal " in their ear...everyone takes a good healthy run at it, hence why you dump the puck, make the pass quickly, get ready for the impact or get the f*** out of the way. so they could ALL be considered charges.

[coriolis]

I would think alot less people would be angry at Lucic/Boston if he was apologetic about it, but he wasn't. Basically Lucic indirectly responded to Miller calling him out(Miller saying that Lucic was gutless for running into him at full speed, and that not only was he larger/bigger(225lbs vs 175lbs, he made no attempt to avoid, threw his arms out, etc) that there was nothing he could do when he was at full speed. He basically didn't care at all.

[Cush29]

+1 exactly what i mean..



wait are you telling me there is some sort of soft gentle checking going on in the NHL going on that im not aware of ? Maybe with pillows? seriously, everyone takes good drive into them, see thats the point of a body check to rattle someone not to gently caress them as you whisper " nice goal first period pal " in their ear...everyone takes a good healthy run at it, hence why you dump the puck, make the pass quickly, get ready for the impact or get the f*** out of the way. so they could ALL be considered charges.

All hits are not charges or they would be called as such. You can choose to misinterrpret the rule as much as you want but it still wont' make you right.

[Soulsofmischief]

All hits are not charges or they would be called as such. You can choose to misinterrpret the rule as much as you want but it still wont' make you right.


actually you just did, because my argument all along has been that the rules can be misinterpretted, weather the goalie is fair game or not is a matter of opinion, i dont believe he should have special status outside of the crease. but fair enough agree to disagree.

[Cush29]

I misinterrpreted the rule? Don't think so.... In my 30+ years of playing and for about 10 of those years refeering hockey I haven't ever seen charging called the way you are talking about it. The rule has been interrpreted a particular way based on the shared belief or understanding of the intent of the charging rule which was essentially to prevent people from taking a 100 foot start before they hit someone.

I will certainly agree that we will continue to disagree on this & leave it at that.

[-RJ3-]

notice his hands... lucic either was trying to slow down and brace himself, or deliberately checked him hard... We will never know.