View Full Version : Transmission Service - drain and fill or filter too?
Marta
08-01-2012, 05:14 PM
Hey,
So I just ordered tranny fluid for 2004 with 113,000km, I dont think the tranny service has ever been done, or atleast not recently (didnt see it in the service records which are a little sporadic though). My tech seems to think its just a drain and fill of the fluid... but is there a filter as well? Is it a lifetime filter, if there is one? Do u reccomend replacing it?
Im particularily interested in doing the tranny flush because of a somewhat harsh shift from 1st to 2nd. I dont know if this is typical for that year, but all the other shifts are SUBSTANTIALLY smother and the first shift worries me a little bit. Can someone tell me if this is typical? Is the auto rpm shift set as such to make the shift a little rough?
Thanks!
Marta
08-01-2012, 05:16 PM
Also, I know there is a chance the tranny service may not help it, but there is a chance it may. Shift isnt bad enough IMO to signal a tranny problem, just not as pleasant as I think it should be.
there has been many threads with regards to the tranny shift.
the 4spd is certainly not as smooth as the 5spd introduced in later years. I do have a 2007 with the 4spd and have always hated the shift from 1-2nd even after warm up and sometimes, depending on acceleration area (hills are the worst jerk) it can be very noticeable.
I have had this jerk since 74,000km and now at 146,xxx km and nothing ever has gone bad with the transmission (shift quality has remained the same), the fluid has been maintained every 50,000km or less.
Have you tried accelearting from an upward incline? Is the jerk more apparent and feels like a 'jolt' ?
I did a transmission flush and it did not help. I'd say 113,000 is a lot for a power flush, a fill and drain is better.
PS - the jerk/jolt doesnt always happen. But it happens more than not.
Marta
08-01-2012, 05:33 PM
there has been many threads with regards to the tranny shift.
the 4spd is certainly not as smooth as the 5spd introduced in later years. I do have a 2007 with the 4spd and have always hated the shift from 1-2nd even after warm up and sometimes, depending on acceleration area (hills are the worst jerk) it can be very noticeable.
I have had this jerk since 74,000km and now at 146,xxx km and nothing ever has gone bad with the transmission (shift quality has remained the same), the fluid has been maintained every 50,000km or less.
Have you tried accelearting from an upward incline? Is the jerk more apparent and feels like a 'jolt' ?
I did a transmission flush and it did not help. I'd say 113,000 is a lot for a power flush, a fill and drain is better.
PS - the jerk/jolt doesnt always happen. But it happens more than not.
hmm interesting. I will try it on an incline...
Needs to be done anyways, just curious to see if this is commonly noted/
hmm interesting. I will try it on an incline...
Needs to be done anyways, just curious to see if this is commonly noted/
It would be a good idea to check the colour/smell of the ATF fluid.
It shouldn't smell like burned toast and should be cherry red (for relatively new).
If it is brown or black (!) - replace asap. But I assume you know those things given your job :)
Marta
08-01-2012, 05:48 PM
It would be a good idea to check the colour/smell of the ATF fluid.
It shouldn't smell like burned toast and should be cherry red (for relatively new).
If it is brown or black (!) - replace asap. But I assume you know those things given your job :)
colour's pretty pink but I found no maintenance record for it and assumed it would somewhat help the shift... hmmmm
FLIPDADY
08-01-2012, 05:48 PM
On my 05 hatch I drain and filled when the ATF fluid was black. Didn't have as many KM's as your car Marta but since I always used the manual mode the fluid was pretty bad at only 75,000km.
No filter to change.
Marta
08-01-2012, 05:59 PM
On my 05 hatch I drain and filled when the ATF fluid was black. Didn't have as many KM's as your car Marta but since I always used the manual mode the fluid was pretty bad at only 75,000km.
No filter to change.
so would you reccomend I hope off on the tranny service? I mean, if it still looks pretty clean and wont smooth the shift, then is there a point?
cwp_sedan
08-01-2012, 06:05 PM
so would you reccomend I hope off on the tranny service? I mean, if it still looks pretty clean and wont smooth the shift, then is there a point?
Do the service if the fluid is burnt at all. On an auto it should be done approx every 50-65k for good measure. I have to do my second one soon also.
I would just do a drain and fill.
Since you said it's pinkish/reddish than you might be okay for a while longer. How many kms have you put on the car?
Do the service if the fluid is burnt at all. On an auto it should be done approx every 50-65k for good measure. I have to do my second one soon also.
I would just do a drain and fill.
Since you said it's pinkish/reddish than you might be okay for a while longer. How many kms have you put on the car?
I agree. Do it just in case. You can start your own schedule for it then. It's not as costly as other things. Usually $100 +/- $20.
Wes08M3
08-01-2012, 10:43 PM
I made sure to drain and fill the transmission on my mom's '07 every 50,000km and it's been really good so far. It still shifts quite smoothly even 1st to 2nd after all those km's. Only when it's very cold have I noticed a bit more of a harsh shift. It's the 4spd auto as well.
At 100,000km (2nd trans fluid change) I started putting a little bit of Lucas "transmission fix" in with the new fluid to help try and keep it shifting smoothly down the road. It didn't have any problems it was just a preventative measure. Maybe you could try that out to help smooth out your 1-2 shift.
Wes08M3
08-01-2012, 10:45 PM
I agree. Do it just in case. You can start your own schedule for it then. It's not as costly as other things. Usually $100 +/- $20.
Drain and fill costs less than 50 bucks. And that's buying enough fluid to drain and refill the pan a few times.
EDIT: maybe your post is referring to having the flush done at a shop. If so, my mistake.
I did 2x drain and fill at Jimmy's at 60k since I was switching to synthetic. Added tranny cooler and did power steering flush as well. Came out to under $100 (minus amsoil fluids and install).
I made sure to drain and fill the transmission on my mom's '07 every 50,000km and it's been really good so far. It still shifts quite smoothly even 1st to 2nd after all those km's. Only when it's very cold have I noticed a bit more of a harsh shift. It's the 4spd auto as well.
At 100,000km (2nd trans fluid change) I started putting a little bit of Lucas "transmission fix" in with the new fluid to help try and keep it shifting smoothly down the road. It didn't have any problems it was just a preventative measure. Maybe you could try that out to help smooth out your 1-2 shift.
Interesting... My 1st-2nd shift has been pretty bad at times, but if it's a defect/damaged transmission, it has been like that for over 70k km .... Mine certainly feels like a 'jolt' at times, more than a 'jerk'.
silverstarmazda
08-02-2012, 02:29 AM
im installing my tranny cooler soon too, gonna do a flush and install. just gotta get the fluids and hardware...i aslo changed the pan, filter, and gasket not too long ago because it was nearly rusted through.
Marta
08-02-2012, 08:20 AM
Drain and fill costs less than 50 bucks. And that's buying enough fluid to drain and refill the pan a few times.
EDIT: maybe your post is referring to having the flush done at a shop. If so, my mistake.
no no, I will have my boys at work do the flush. So it will be costing me less than 50 bucks. Only thing is, I have no idea when/if ever a tranny flush was EVER done. Considering its still a nice shade of pink, I assume it must of been changed at some point.
I dont know whether to do it cause its cheap anyways, or whether to do a BFF or PSF instead... hmmm.
im installing my tranny cooler soon too, gonna do a flush and install. just gotta get the fluids and hardware...i aslo changed the pan, filter, and gasket not too long ago because it was nearly rusted through.
I have a lot of leftover mounting hardware like brackets and whatnot. Let me know if you want them.
TheMAN
08-02-2012, 06:45 PM
everyone forgot about the ECU update that fixes the 1-2 shift problem? :rolleyes
everyone forgot about the ECU update that fixes the 1-2 shift problem? :rolleyes
No. That ECU update doesn't always fix 'it' - whatever that jerk might be. We are not talking in cold weather or pre-warm up.
Marta
08-03-2012, 08:45 AM
what is this ECU update? Is it like a computer flash? Is it a rapid response or a recall or smthg?
96coroll
08-03-2012, 07:40 PM
Just my two cents...
I've done flushs on my 96 corolla (auto) and every time i did the flush every 30,000km the shifting was so nice like the car was saying thank you.
On my 05 mazda 3 (standard) i changed the tranny oil right when i got it at 75,000 km on the odometer. I changed it with redline mt-90 if i remember correctly. Shifting greatly improved.
In conclusion - Changing your fluid is never a bad thing, and it's less than 50 dollars i'd say if you have any doubt with the fluid (when it was last done) it's a no brainer to get it done.
silverstarmazda
08-03-2012, 10:42 PM
man, ive been on this tranny fluid research its been hurting my head lately... (literal) mazda's MV fluid contains some sort of anti shock additive apparently...mercon v is not intended for the transmission, but can be used as a substitute at your own risk. i ran this through my tranny wen i used to work for ford and its still red after half a year. i had a gift card for walmart, so this is where i got my new tranny fluids. walmart only seems to stock 2 fluids that are compatible for our cars. valvoline maxlife ATF dex/merc, and castrol import atf. i got the castrol and will be swapping soon. also heard that the mazda MV fluids dont last very long either.... and valvoline doesnt performa too good in the cold. ofc, im only talking about walmart, im sure other places will have more suitable fluids. one of the bests is mobil 1 synthetic atf apparently.
shit... i just realized.. how am i gonna see if i ran all the old fluid out if its still bright red =.=
Wes08M3
08-03-2012, 11:13 PM
I used Castrol Import ATF the first time I changed the trans fluid at 50,000km. It was perfectly fine...
I've used the Mazda MV fluid ever since, it lasts 50,000km no problem. Mind you, I added a bit of Lucas to it which apparently extends fluid life.
Only reason I stopped using the Castrol was because it wasn't much cheaper than the OEM stuff, so I figured it was safer to just go OEM especially for warranty purposes.
silverstarmazda
08-03-2012, 11:15 PM
I used Castrol Import ATF the first time I changed the trans fluid at 50,000km. It was perfectly fine...
I've used the Mazda MV fluid ever since, it lasts 50,000km no problem. Mind you, I added a bit of Lucas to it which apparently extends fluid life.
Only reason I stopped using the Castrol was because it wasn't much cheaper than the OEM stuff, so I figured it was safer to just go OEM especially for warranty purposes.
+1 i wanted to go with mobil 1 atf synthetic. but ive heard its no longer available in canada? anyone confirm this? im going with castrol this time just cuz i had a gift card lol
Wes08M3
08-03-2012, 11:24 PM
+1 i wanted to go with mobil 1 atf synthetic. but ive heard its no longer available in canada? anyone confirm this? im going with castrol this time just cuz i had a gift card lol
I'm pretty sure I saw it at Canadian Tire last time I was there. It's still on their website for $12.99/L
TheMAN
08-07-2012, 01:50 AM
valvoline maxlife is a full synthetic ATF (not advertised)
one of the best cheap ATFs money can buy
Marta
08-07-2012, 08:28 AM
ya, screw it Im gonna change it anyways so atleast I know I have some good product in her
thanks all ya'alllzzzz
Jackal
08-09-2012, 10:06 AM
ya, screw it Im gonna change it anyways so atleast I know I have some good product in her
thanks all ya'alllzzzz
Must have been payday. Best decision!
silverstarmazda
08-09-2012, 02:43 PM
btw draining and filling will only remove half of the fluids... u need to disconect it from the cooling block and run it for a bit to get the old crap out
aznives3
08-28-2012, 11:32 AM
btw draining and filling will only remove half of the fluids... u need to disconect it from the cooling block and run it for a bit to get the old crap out
this. i did a full flush of the fluids at 120K (it was pretty dark, but didn't really smell all that burnt). took 9L i believe, and only about 30 min of my time and some help from my dad. I followed the DIY on one of the other mazda3 forums to pull the cooler line and drain through there, worked perfect!
btw draining and filling will only remove half of the fluids... u need to disconect it from the cooling block and run it for a bit to get the old crap out
my understanding is that drain/fill is better then a full flush? well what I mean is that a full flush is not necessary unless switching to synthetic. Please correct me if I'm wrong as I'm looking to get both a coolant drain/fill and transmission fluid drain/fill done soon
silverstarmazda
08-28-2012, 01:25 PM
my understanding is that drain/fill is better then a full flush? well what I mean is that a full flush is not necessary unless switching to synthetic. Please correct me if I'm wrong as I'm looking to get both a coolant drain/fill and transmission fluid drain/fill done soon
well flushing will get the most old fluid out because your using a machine to flush the old fluid out with the new fluid. if your not having problems i wouldnt recommend a flush. switching to a synthetic should be alright as long as its compatible with the old fluid. this is how i did my "flush"
-drain old trans fluid
-refill with new fluid
-disconect cooling block
-run a hose from cooling block to a drain pan
- start the car and run through all the gears while your foot is on the brakes so the car doesnt move (this will cause the old transmission fluid in the torque converter out while drawing the new fluid into it.)
-run the car untill you see about 3 quarts comming out of the car. then shut it off
-refill the transmission
-run the car again like before until you see another 1-2 quarts come out, or the fluid is bright red.
turn off the car and reconnect everything.
-refill the transmission and let the car run for 5 minutes.
-if all the fluids are leveled, take it out for a drive. check the fluids again.
note: check the transmission dip stick while the car is running. heres a how to:
http://www.mazda3forums.com/index.php?topic=66369.0
i used more fluid than necessary because i wanted to make sure i got most of the old fluid out and i also added a cooler.
TheMAN
08-31-2012, 04:53 PM
flushing is only truely necessary if you decided to switch to synthetic, that way everything will be synthetic afterwards and you get the full benefits synthetic has to offer :)
the petrol canada and valvoline maxlife ATFs are cheap and good synthetics money can buy, otherwise you're going to be spending money on the redline ATF D4 or amsoil ATF
silverstarmazda
08-31-2012, 05:18 PM
flushing is only truely necessary if you decided to switch to synthetic, that way everything will be synthetic afterwards and you get the full benefits synthetic has to offer :)
the petrol canada and valvoline maxlife ATFs are cheap and good synthetics money can buy, otherwise you're going to be spending money on the redline ATF D4 or amsoil ATF
i had 2 options when i bought trans fluid from walmart. the valvoline maxlife atf OR the castrol import atf. both are usable in our auto's requiring MV. i chose to go with the castrol because i heard the maxlife doesnt do too well in he cold. not sure why but im assuming its the oil viscosity. and since the climate is starting to get cool, and i installed a cooler i wanted to make sure i could use it all year around. both received good reviews everywhere, thats why it took me about a 3 days worth of reading reviews to make up my mind @_@ sudden jerking in a cold engine seem to be smoothed out, its still there but its definitely smoothed out. acceleration has gotten better and is more consistent. overall im happy im done with my transmission
TheMAN
08-31-2012, 07:31 PM
the castrol is a conventional fluid IIRC... maxlife works fine in the cold... if it's an issue, add some lubegard
silverstarmazda
09-01-2012, 12:06 AM
the castrol is a conventional fluid IIRC... maxlife works fine in the cold... if it's an issue, add some lubegard
yea i understand its conventional. but then again...its tranny fluid, that stuff lasts quiet a bit. im not too keep on the whole additive thing...
TheMAN
09-01-2012, 12:28 AM
lubegard works fine... it's tried and true... the name sounds like snake oil, but it's not!!!
read BITOG as I always said, and you'll see that it works!
I put that stuff in my van and also a mazda5, with maxlife in both of them.... works great!
canscot05
12-14-2012, 11:48 AM
Just did my change to synthetic, Petro Canada DuraDrive MV, $80 for 12 litres. Dropped transmission pan, and magnet was sludgey, has done 90k, don't know if first change or not, have installed Magnafine filter to help clean up the fluid going forward, does seem smoother shifting afterwards.
rajin929
12-18-2012, 11:57 AM
man i'm afraid to drop the pan....with all the bolts rusted to crap, knowing my luck I'd snap a bolt or two.
I've just been drain and filling every 6 months with the Valvoline Max Life stuff. Probably overkill on the time between changes, but I guess it doesn't hurt to keep throwing fresh fluid in it.
canscot05
12-18-2012, 02:01 PM
I just view it like any other fluid/oil change, cheap insurance. I did the full flush as I didn't know the history on the transmission, when I bought the car it had a big bundle of receipts for work done, every oil change, replace tires, tire rotation, etc, but I couldn't find anything for transmission, except for dealership suggesting the work at 48,000km. So I decided to start with clean fluid, and once I dropped the pan and saw the magnet I was glad I did, at least now I can start my service intervals from this point. I would rather drain and fill on a regular basis than wait until the fluid looks or smells bad, as some damage is done by that point. With the Duradrive at less than $7 a litre, the cost won't be too great going forward.
TheMAN
12-19-2012, 07:42 PM
man i'm afraid to drop the pan....with all the bolts rusted to crap, knowing my luck I'd snap a bolt or two.
I've just been drain and filling every 6 months with the Valvoline Max Life stuff. Probably overkill on the time between changes, but I guess it doesn't hurt to keep throwing fresh fluid in it.
no need to drop the pan with your frequent draining
and it's absolutely not necessary because maxlife is synthetic! you'll probably be fine for 100000km on this fluid.... just keep an eye on it!
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