Freedom at its Finest

[pwdunmore]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-WMn_zHCVo

Posted on MSF, thought I would share. Cops abusing their powers without consquences... Yes they keep people safe but we all know they are just trying to make a small bust out of something small.

Get the drunk people off the road... stop wasting innocent people's time by trying to make a point that you guys are the ones in power...

I like cops... I just hate the ones that do this crap. They should get their car searched and ripped apart once in a while to see what it's like to walk back to your car in a mess.

They get rewarded with convictions but they don't suffer any consquences for mistakes like the rest of the working class?!?!? eff off... :bang

[Chrisinski]

In the united states due to a law that passed the authorities can detain you for aslong as they want with no given reason besides them stating we have concerns that this person is a terrorist or that there is belief he has intentions to do bodly harm to other people. This law was passed by simply scarring the public into voting for it by saying " we are doing it to protect our nation". As far as I am concerned, when the American people voted for this to take effect. They signed away there freedom. This bill is waiting to be passed here in Canada.

[pwdunmore]

In the united states due to a law that passed the authorities can detain you for aslong as they want with no given reason besides them stating we have concerns that this person is a terrorist or that there is belief he has intentions to do bodly harm to other people. This law was passed by simply scarring the public into voting for it by saying " we are doing it to protect our nation". As far as I am concerned, when the American people voted for this to take effect. They signed away there freedom. This bill is waiting to be passed here in Canada.

Very sad... kinda funny though... "Terrorism" is being used the same way as "Witchcraft" back in the day...

[n00bMeiSter]

Honestly though, while I agree wholeheartedly with you and this guy, he brought that on himself and deserved it. It's a f*cking window, just roll it down. Had he simply rolled his window down, there wouldn't have been any issue, they would have asked him if he was drinking, he'd say no and he'd be on his way. One of the reasons they started in on him is because people who have something to hide, generally do shit like that; they don't want to roll their window down because they are afraid the officer might see or smell something that will get them in trouble.

[Chrisinski]

Honestly though, while I agree wholeheartedly with you and this guy, he brought that on himself and deserved it. It's a f*cking window, just roll it down. Had he simply rolled his window down, there wouldn't have been any issue, they would have asked him if he was drinking, he'd say no and he'd be on his way. One of the reasons they started in on him is because people who have something to hide, generally do shit like that; they don't want to roll their window down because they are afraid the officer might see or smell something that will get them in trouble.

I agree

Yes sir/ mam and no sir/mam keeps you clear. I would never allow them to search me tho. You dont have to let them and you can charge if done so without rightful cause ( unless you are in the states ).

But this was simply done to show how in the wrong police can be.

[pwdunmore]

I agree

Yes sir/ mam and no sir/mam keeps you clear. I would never allow them to search me tho. You dont have to let them and you can charge if done so without rightful cause ( unless you are in the states ).

But this was simply done to show how in the wrong police can be.

Not to mention the police are legally allowed to lie to you...

[ZeroChalk]

Not to mention the police are legally allowed to lie to you...

It's a fine line... Imagine if they weren't?

Undercop *thinking*: Please don't ask if I am a cop... please don't ask me.. *nervous*
Mafia Hitman: "So are you a cop?"
Undercop: "Ah.. F$()(%*!"

[Jsquared]

Honestly though, while I agree wholeheartedly with you and this guy, he brought that on himself and deserved it. It's a f*cking window, just roll it down. Had he simply rolled his window down, there wouldn't have been any issue, they would have asked him if he was drinking, he'd say no and he'd be on his way. One of the reasons they started in on him is because people who have something to hide, generally do shit like that; they don't want to roll their window down because they are afraid the officer might see or smell something that will get them in trouble.

What I find funny is when I did a few ride alongs with various officers within the OPP, I was told if someone approaches the cruiser to only open the window 2 or 3 inches which is more than enough space for voices to carry and people to be heard.

[pwdunmore]

It's a fine line... Imagine if they weren't?

Undercop *thinking*: Please don't ask if I am a cop... please don't ask me.. *nervous*
Mafia Hitman: "So are you a cop?"
Undercop: "Ah.. F$()(%*!"

lmao classic... good point but they shouldn't be able to lie about the laws you are questioning

[Aitch]

What I find funny is when I did a few ride alongs with various officers within the OPP, I was told if someone approaches the cruiser to only open the window 2 or 3 inches which is more than enough space for voices to carry and people to be heard.

Yes, this applies if you are in the cruiser. Think about it, a cop is approached by someone they don't know and are sitting (lower position) and strapped in - at a major disadvantage if the person approaching is intending to attach the cop.

If you're in your car and a cop approaches you, and you roll down the window only a small amount - the cop assumes either you have something to hide, are similarly protecting yourself because you believe an altercation will break out, or both. If you have nothing to hide, roll down the damn window.

[Aitch]

Let me just add - did the officer go too far in his response? Probably. However you can also argue that the kid brought it on himself. You want to prove that you know the law and that cops can and will abuse their power if provoked? Fine. Just be prepared to sit cuffed while they search your car. Or you could just, you know, roll down the window like a gentleman.

[Genpu_Mz3]

if people are interested in all this sorta stuff, check out alex jones at www.infowars.com he rants all day long about the american "police state" he has a daily live radio stream.

[pwdunmore]

Let me just add - did the officer go too far in his response? Probably. However you can also argue that the kid brought it on himself. You want to prove that you know the law and that cops can and will abuse their power if provoked? Fine. Just be prepared to sit cuffed while they search your car. Or you could just, you know, roll down the window like a gentleman.

And what if someone is impersonating an officer? The slight roll down might have just saved your neck from being grabbed?

By cracking the window you can smell and hear whatever is going on in the vehicle... just playing devil's advocate :P
And what's the difference between them and us? a badge and some training? absolute power = absolute corruption... if you can't question the laws/police officer about their actions how the heck are we suppose to protect ourselves from being victims of the police?

I have been searched without a warrant and nothing happened... I told the cop I didn't permit searches without a warrant but the did it anyways. He did not have just cause either... so wtf. I didn't have anything to hide, but what if I had the smallest 0.1g of weed?!?!? all of a sudden I am a criminal trafficing drugs?!?! lmao... all from an unwarranted search that I didnt consent to. Funny thing was he pulled me over for doing the speed limit... "you were changing you speed up and down too much so it looked suspicious" - cop.

[6strings]

Why didn't he just roll the window down, answer the questions. And gone home to **** his sister.

People have rights and I agree. I also agree that some cops have a power trip and let it out on people. But you have two bone head jackwhores trying to stand up for something that can easily be avoided with compliance and patience.
Cops says roll down the window, just do it, he's creating a situation for a bone head police officer to take it way past reason.
The kid asked for it by pissing off an already pissed off ******* of a cop.

[terapr0]

it's an incredibly slippery slope. One minute they're asking you to FULLY roll down the window, the next it's something more, and something bigger after that. I'm no freedom fighter or conspiracy theorist, but I can appreciate those who fight these small battles every day. More importantly, the police expect every single one of us to follow the law precisely as written. No excuses. I believe they should be held to the same standard, and that if they're not allowed to make someone roll down the window completely, that they dont try and enforce that non-existent policy.

I'm reading "Winter Of The World" by Ken Follet right now, and they're at the part where, in the 1930's, the german government and police forces were slowly taken over by Nazi control. Good people stood by and watched as small, seemingly insignificant pieces of their freedoms were taken away, bit by bit. It started as something small, and grew into you know what. Our grandparents fought (or died) to protect our freedoms and our way of life....dont think for one second that we're entirely secure in our current existence. If good people stand by and make concession after concession, good WILL be eclipsed by evil. I hope none of you are so naive as to think that freedom, democracy and peace are guaranteed or irrefutable, no matter where you live.

[geobur]

it's an incredibly slippery slope. One minute they're asking you to FULLY roll down the window, the next it's something more, and something bigger after that. I'm no freedom fighter or conspiracy theorist, but I can appreciate those who fight these small battles every day. More importantly, the police expect every single one of us to follow the law precisely as written. No excuses. I believe they should be held to the same standard, and that if they're not allowed to make someone roll down the window completely, that they dont try and enforce that non-existent policy.

I'm reading "Winter Of The World" by Ken Follet right now, and they're at the part where, in the 1930's, the german government and police forces were slowly taken over by Nazi control. Good people stood by and watched as small, seemingly insignificant pieces of their freedoms were taken away, bit by bit. It started as something small, and grew into you know what. Our grandparents fought (or died) to protect our freedoms and our way of life....dont think for one second that we're entirely secure in our current existence. If good people stand by and make concession after concession, good WILL be eclipsed by evil. I hope none of you are so naive as to think that freedom, democracy and peace are guaranteed or irrefutable, no matter where you live.

+1 agreed

[slam525i]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peelian_Principles

There was a time when policing was based on a system of consent. That is to say the public accepts the good that policing can do, and consents to being policed. The police acts on behalf of the citizens according to the wishes of the citizens. Their power and authority rested on what the citizens wanted.

Today, the power of the police isn't limited by the citizens; it is limited by how far they can transgress across the legal line. Things like the Street Racing amendments to the HTA hasn't helped by giving powers to the police that contradicts centuries of jurisprudence; lessons paid for by the blood and suffering of countless people through centuries of history, giving us the Magna Carta and Habeas Corpus, thrown away with "Think of the children" and "You have nothing to fear if you did nothing wrong".

If the police are not policing by consent and are only limited by the law, then we must do what is needed to protect ourselves against this power imbalance. (Take that last sentence however you feel appropriate.)

Incidentally, drivers aren't the only ones who are oppressed by law enforcement institutions. Pilots have recently found themselves being illegally detained and searched without valid grounds of suspicion.

I'm sorry if this seems like a strange rant. It's a topic that touches a nerve in me for some reason.

"They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." -Benjamin Franklin

[pwdunmore]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peelian_Principles

There was a time when policing was based on a system of consent. That is to say the public accepts the good that policing can do, and consents to being policed. The police acts on behalf of the citizens according to the wishes of the citizens. Their power and authority rested on what the citizens wanted.

Today, the power of the police isn't limited by the citizens; it is limited by how far they can transgress across the legal line. Things like the Street Racing amendments to the HTA hasn't helped by giving powers to the police that contradicts centuries of jurisprudence; lessons paid for by the blood and suffering of countless people through centuries of history, giving us the Magna Carta and Habeas Corpus, thrown away with "Think of the children" and "You have nothing to fear if you did nothing wrong".

If the police are not policing by consent and are only limited by the law, then we must do what is needed to protect ourselves against this power imbalance. (Take that last sentence however you feel appropriate.)

Incidentally, drivers aren't the only ones who are oppressed by law enforcement institutions. Pilots have recently found themselves being illegally detained and searched without valid grounds of suspicion.

I'm sorry if this seems like a strange rant. It's a topic that touches a nerve in me for some reason.

"They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." -Benjamin Franklin

Wow... that was an awesome rant. I thanks for sharing that was very enlightening, I feel the same way. I want the police to be empowered but not by the means that they are going about it currently. It's a very slippery slope as terapr0 said before, the police take advantage of their power situation sometimes and there should be a way to even up the playing ground without making things confrontational.

[Nooby31]

This is what begins to happen when safety prevails over our basic human Rights. The government creats a problem and creates a solution which slowly eats away our rights and liberties.

Just look south of the border where you find laws such as being arrested without a reason or cause.

All in the name of safety.

[asyed]

As much as I would have done this myself. I dont think its worth the trouble in many cases. Sure alot of them go away without a ticket but the amount of trouble and time wasted isnt worth it. Plus I dont want any further damage to my car because of the canine unit scratching it up.

[r4mi5awi]

As much as I would have done this myself. I dont think its worth the trouble in many cases. Sure alot of them go away without a ticket but the amount of trouble and time wasted isnt worth it. Plus I dont want any further damage to my car because of the canine unit scratching it up.

+1 Cops are the wrong type of people to go out looking for trouble with.

[Jeff-TheBiz]

Honestly though, while I agree wholeheartedly with you and this guy, he brought that on himself and deserved it. It's a f*cking window, just roll it down. Had he simply rolled his window down, there wouldn't have been any issue, they would have asked him if he was drinking, he'd say no and he'd be on his way. One of the reasons they started in on him is because people who have something to hide, generally do shit like that; they don't want to roll their window down because they are afraid the officer might see or smell something that will get them in trouble.


+1

Long story short... act like an ass... get treated like an ass.

[pwdunmore]

+1

Long story short... act like an ass... get treated like an ass.

Cops act like asses sometimes too but they never suffer any consequences... So how is that fair? There should be some kind of fairness. If I'm being polite and the cop decides to be a douche there is nothing to stop him/her from abusing his/her powers other than his/her own morals.

[Akiba48]

Saw this video on reddit a few days ago, IMO this guy deserved the treatment.
It's not like the police was pointing a gun to your head. The way he questions "authority" will certainly ring bells that he's acting suspicious, or trying to hide something.
Yes, we don't have to do what we're told unless it's required...but it's just their job, they want to get it over with as much as you do. All they want was a simple yes/no answer from a DUI checkpoint.

[jaimie08mazda3]

You know what I do have respect and understanding for Police. That being said there is a point. For example OPP have always been very friendly and fair. Always liked them. However the one time I get pulled over by a Halton police officer the guy abuses his power and tells me I did something that he did right after I did. So how does that make sense? And the way he did it was worse (I did a u-turn and there was a car 200+ ft away from me and I never cut him off and he didnt slam on his brakes yet the cop pulled out right in front of him to pull me over and I did wrong). It all really depends on the officer. Out here in Guelph we got alot of the young cops who believe they are beyond the law driving through red lights turning the cherries on and off once they get through. Sitting talking and pulling people over for 10 over the speed limit. There was this video I had seen a few weeks back of this guy taking a video of the police arresting somebody while he was walking his dog and then as they approached him he went to his Mazda2 and they called him over and started trying to get him on the ground to arrest him the dog came out of the car and started barking at the cop. Instead of the cop trying to get the guy to get his dog under control the cop shoots it 3 times and kills it. And what for? Because it seemed like the easiest way. That kinda shit makes me sick. Just my 2 cents.

[Genpu_Mz3]

Out here in Guelph we got alot of the young cops who believe they are beyond the law driving through red lights turning the cherries on and off once they get through. Sitting talking and pulling people over for 10 over the speed limit.
+1

they are all young and trying to make a name for themselves, when all they're doing is creating more paper work, lol, I like the older cops, more forgiving and or hate paper work.

[jaimie08mazda3]

No kidding. I like them too because they are pretty good and they just don't want you to be a complete idiot on the roads which makes perfect sense. Then again we live in a town with a bunch of idiots who think they are hard cuz they chill downtown and even more that have civics and think they are just the coolest *minus the couple of them that I know and have done alot to their cars* and all these cops prey on us young guys with modded cars.

[asyed]

There will always be a fair share of good/bad police officers. You just have to live with it and try not to break any laws especially infront of them. I have never really experienced dealing with a police officer as I have never been pulled over as a driver. Only thing that pisses me off is how dangerously the OPP sometimes drives on the freeways. I have seen them become inches of rear ending some guy in the fast lane so they could get him to move over so the cop could pull over the car infront of said car he just tailgated. I have also seem them weave in and out of traffic using no turn signals at all ( with their police lights off) and they werent even trying to catch anyone. Not to mention that alot of these drive in excess of 125 kph with no good reasoning.... yet the same guy will pull you over if you do the same.



If the OPP/ any other police department wants people to drive safely they should tell their officers to do the same.

[m_bisson]

I answered yes once when I got pulled over, but said it was a couple hours since my last drink. They just waved me through. Be honest with them and they'll treat you decently. If you hassle them then they'll hassle you.

[6strings]

Speaking of freedom at its finest, how about that zimmerman guy?

[pwdunmore]

Speaking of freedom at its finest, how about that zimmerman guy?

Ya wtf... that is the most random crap I have ever seen! He is gonna have to be in some crazy "victim" protection programs otherwise he is gonna be harrassed everywhere he goes.

[geobur]

Cops act like asses sometimes too but they never suffer any consequences... So how is that fair? There should be some kind of fairness. If I'm being polite and the cop decides to be a douche there is nothing to stop him/her from abusing his/her powers other than his/her own morals.

agreed...you can give them the benefit of the doubt and say...oh he was a douche because he was having a bad day...a citizen acts like a douche to a cop after being pulled over and he is likely to be searched or have a ticket slammed down on him...(yet the police have no idea that the guys wife just left or whatever...) And yet when a cop is a douche to us...we end up with a ticket and a bad mood and we can't do anything about it.

[Dan Da Man]

agreed...you can give them the benefit of the doubt and say...oh he was a douche because he was having a bad day...a citizen acts like a douche to a cop after being pulled over and he is likely to be searched or have a ticket slammed down on him...(yet the police have no idea that the guys wife just left or whatever...) And yet when a cop is a douche to us...we end up with a ticket and a bad mood and we can't do anything about it.

how is he supposed to know if you don't tell them, they are people too and can sympathize, "hey officer im having a really shit day can you help me out, my whore wife just left me" or "my ******* boss ruined my day" something like that, these guys are people too and most have a dark sense of humour.

im sure he'd let you off, haha, but if you lie and he sees through it i think your screwed!

[krimsalt]

Very sad... kinda funny though... "Terrorism" is being used the same way as "Witchcraft" back in the day...

so true, or even not that long ago "communists". It's just the use of scapegoating to force the population to blame others for problems in the country. have you seen the ranking for amount of people killed by terrorism? It falls WAY below murder, which falls way below issues with health care, obesity, or diabetes