HID Bulbs

[firstmazda]

I didn\'t think there were nough topics on HIDs! haha j/k

Just a couple quick questions:
The Kelvin rating depends on the BULBS and NOT the ballast, Is this correct?

What are \"REBASED\" bulbs? (That Xenon Expert sells)
does rebased = refurbished??

One more.....
Since Xtec has a good bllast, but simpler bulbs, is it possible to
get te more affordable kit (Xtec) and buy the Phillips bulbs from Xenon Expert??
Will they go together, and be cheaper??

Hmmm, I think that\'s it for now!

Thanks,
Ray

[majic]

from what i remember from previous posts, the balast and the bulb is connected with a wire and some adapter/socket. now the adapter seems to be different from bulb to bulb. so based on my knowledge and minimal expertise :p on HIDs i would say no you can\'t get phillips bulbs to fit with the Xtec (hella) balasts. someone correct me and i\'ll delete this post not to cause confusion.

MajesticBlueN\'s Xtec kit
http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/1/web/337000-337999/337094_51_full.jpg

M3-GT\'s Phillips kit
http://www.xenonexpert.com/guides/image_hid_kit1.jpg

now that i\'ve consulted a few sources, the ballast = (inverter + igniter + current limiter) takes on the role of converting 12V DC into ~25000V AC and ignites the gas and makes it glow. so it is imperative to pair it up with a proper bulb.

also.. i just found this article (http://www.energybooks.com/toc/toc0903.htm) which talks about HID street lamps but i have a feeling it can easily apply to the car HIDs..



Also explained are the selection factors for HID ballasts, which must be matched precisely to the lamps. At present, most HID ballasts are magnetic. The main types are reactor ballasts, constant wattage ballasts, and constant wattage autotransformer ballasts. Their characteristics include input wattage, current output, crest factor, efficiency, lamp compatibility, starting temperature, dimming capability, acoustical noise, power factor, and harmonic distortion. Ballasts for metal halide lamps and high pressure sodium lamps may require separate capacitors or ignitors.


EDIT: might as well make a small FAQ out of this

source: (http://www.hitechimportlighting.com/techinfofaq.htm)


let\'s think of the rainbow concept that we mentioned earlier beginning with the red side which is the incandescent bulb rated at 2400K to 2600K. As you move through the spectrum you will go through orange, yellow, white and then start to go into the blue and finally ultra violet. As the human eye sees light we all note that blue is actually the hardest to see with. This of course is due to the fact that blue light has the shortest wave length and is not recommended for good vision. Hence the reason that most current generation of HID systems have gone to a lower Kelvin rating. Rainy weather is the worst to be using bluish light in because the wet surfaces actually absorb the blue light and give you little return of information on what is actually there, sight wise.


more on ballast\'s purpose (http://members.misty.com/don/dschtech.html#n)


In a high-pressure lamp, if current increases, the arc gets hotter. This tremendously increases the concentration of ions and free electrons, making the arc that much more conductive. The conductivity of the arc increases enough that the voltage across the arc usually stays about the same or even decreases if the current is increased.

In a low-pressure lamp, a variation of this causes the same thing. If you double the current, you usually roughly double the concentration of excited gas atoms and free electrons. The concentration of ions must match that of free electrons but each excited atom is bombarded twice as much by free electrons (remember, there are twice as many electrons around for an excited atom to see). The average kinetic energy of the free electrons must decrease so that ion concentration is also only roughly doubled. To get slower free electrons, the electric field in the discharge (and voltage across the discharge) must decrease.

In either case, it is not a good idea to connect the lamp directly to a voltage source. Once the lamp starts conducting, increasing current will increase the lamp\'s conductivity, allowing more current to flow. This process does not level off until one of the following happens:

1. A large fraction of easily ionizable atoms are ionized,

2. The concentration of ions/free electrons is so high that more of these somehow impairs mobility of free electrons,

3. The power supply\'s or wiring\'s limitations limit the current.

At this point, the current is usually around or over 100 amps or so, and will likely blow fuses/pop breakers, and is certainly not good for the lamp.

The term \"negative resistance\" refers to a decrease in voltage across the lamp resulting from an increase in current through the lamp.


to be continued...

[firstmazda]

WOW!
you should change your name from \"Magic\" to \"Mr. Wizard\"
Remember him from TV??? He was the best!

[MajesticBlueNTO]

Originally posted by firstmazda


WOW!
you should change your name from \"Magic\" to \"Mr. Wizard\"
Remember him from TV??? He was the best!

the one i remember most was when he sprinkled lycopodium powder into the aquarium and the girl stuck her whole hand in and it didn\'t get wet.

much like what is described here (http://www.cmste.uregina.ca/Quickstarts/powderglove.html) :D

[majic]

hey.. i\'m just learning as i research this stuff for everyone :D

[RedRaptor]

Originally posted by firstmazda

Just a couple quick questions:
The Kelvin rating depends on the BULBS and NOT the ballast, Is this correct?

What are \"REBASED\" bulbs? (That Xenon Expert sells)
does rebased = refurbished??


Ray,

The colour temperature rating depends on the HID bulb and not the ballast.

Rebased does not mean refurbished. It means that an HID bulb which has no form fit (ie. 9004, 9005, 9007, H7) is \"rebased\" to fit into one of the halogen bulb types so we can retrofit them into our cars.

The Xtec and Philips kit are two different kits so you will not be able to use the bulbs between the two kits unless you manually soldnered the bulbs onto the non matching ballast. I wouldn\'t recommend that since if anything happens to the bulbs or ballast, its a lot of work in troubleshooting.

Hope this helps.

[///M]

Originally posted by majic

MajesticBlueN\'s Xtec kit
http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/1/web/337000-337999/337094_51_full.jpg

M3-GT\'s Phillips kit
http://www.xenonexpert.com/guides/image_hid_kit1.jpg


The Xtec looks a lot simpler to install.

[firstmazda]

Originally posted by RedRaptor


Hope this helps.

This answers all my questions, Thanks Red!!

[Xenon Expert]

The Xtec is a \"little\" easier to install. The Philips kit does provide more protection because of 2 separate relays and fuses. The power is taken from the battery so your car factory wires are completely 100% safe. It\'s details like that that makes Philips based kits the best....Xtec is still very very good but it\'s not Philips.

You can actually buy our connectors and Philips rebased bulbs and you\'d be able to run them from your Xtec ballast btw.;)

[MajesticBlueNTO]

Originally posted by Xenon Expert


The Xtec is a \"little\" easier to install. The Philips kit does provide more protection because of 2 separate relays and fuses. The power is taken from the battery so your car factory wires are completely 100% safe. It\'s details like that that makes Philips based kits the best....Xtec is still very very good but it\'s not Philips.

You can actually buy our connectors and Philips rebased bulbs and you\'d be able to run them from your Xtec ballast btw.;)

Let\'s bring this thread back from the dead.

In the quote above, M3-GT/Xenon Expert says that the \"The Philips kit does provide more protection because of 2 separate relays and fuses. The power is taken from the battery so your car factory wires are completely 100% safe.\" yet, in this thread on M3F (http://www.mazda3forums.com/viewtopic.php?t=13639), when referencing this pic of the \"No-DRL Relay Mod\" in this thread on TM3 (http://torontomazda3.com/forum/read.php?TID=1341):

http://www.geocities.com/vchung007/XTecInstallationWiringDiagram.jpg
Image courtesy of chaser

he says:


Originally posted by M3-GT/Xenon Expert
This is not a safe way to do it. Plus if you want to retro back to halogen if you sell your car or give it back after a lease you have messed with the factory wires. But it works....I wouldn\'t do that but it works.

yes, i\'ve taken that out of context and the whole discussion in the thread on M3F gets into a long exchange between M3-GT/Xenon Expert and myself; with M3-GT/Xenon Expert providing no valid reason as to why he wouldn\'t do the \"No-DRL Relay Mod\". Where is this going? Well, after looking at this pic for the first time since October 2004:

http://www.xenonexpert.com/guides/image_hid_kit1.jpg

it dawned on me that the \"No-DRL Relay Mod\" is even SIMPLER on the Polarion HID Kit (sold by M3-GT/Xenon Expert). All you have to do with the Polarion HID Kit is tap into the parking light wire and put it on one of the wires going to the \"factory headlight plug\". In this pic below, rather than having both wires go into the stock headlight plug, connect one of the wires into the tapped parking light wire. That\'s IT!

http://www.xenonexpert.com/guides/image_hid9.jpg

The wires in the Polarion Kit going \"to factory headlight plug\" is the Switched Input on the relay (which is why \"polarity doesn\'t matter\"). The other wires are the fused +12V input, the Ground and the +12V output.

What does this mean? Well, aside from the \"No-DRL Relay Mod\" being a safer way to wire the XTEC HID Kit, it pretty much wires the XTEC Kit like the Polarion HID Kit.

So M3-GT/Xenon Expert/Oliver, is having a relay safe or unsafe? Looks like he pretty much contradicted himself. (yes, in that thread he did retract his \"unsafe\" remark, but his initial comment was made without basis).

So, for those who choose to purchase the Polarion HID kit, if you don\'t want to use your HIDs as DRLs, just tap the parking light wire and connect it to one of the wires shown above. To keep some other form of DRLs, you can do the independent fog mod available here (http://www.mazda3forums.com/viewtopic.php?t=11730), or will M3-GT/Xenon Expert/Oliver take that down and start charging for that information too? :sarc If that\'s the case, you can get it done at Lockdown Enterprises for cheaper than the $25USD being charged by M3-GT/Xenon Expert/Oliver for his DRL bypass guide.


You might be asking yourself \"why the long post about this and what\'s your beef with M3-GT/Xenon Expert/Oliver?\" Well, anyone that charges for a \"how-to\" (it\'s just a guide, he isn\'t installing this..but, yes, it is included \"free\" when you buy a kit from him) when it should really be freely available information, is not a car enthusiast trying to help out the community, he\'s a business man first and foremost looking to make a quick buck (you think this guy (http://www.msprotege.com/vbb225/showthread.php?s=&threadid=26232) charged for the amount of time and effort put in? Doesn\'t look like it.). Not only that, BUT when someone else (myself in this case (http://www.mazda3forums.com/viewtopic.php?t=13639)) tries to help out the 3 community and they are discredited by said business man, then that just isn\'t right.

In conclusion, if you want a Polarion HID Kit, buy one from Xenon Factory (http://www.xenonfactory.com/products/hid/polarion.htm); if you want a XTEC kit, buy one from Devin/The Xenon Store (http://www.thexenonstore.com/). Why support someone who pulls his once free guide and then begins charging for it when he doesn\'t want to answer anymore questions because people didn\'t buy a HID kit from him. :sarc

[Jer]

Thx for the info :) Time for an Xtec kit :)


Originally posted by MajesticBlueN



Originally posted by Xenon Expert


The Xtec is a \"little\" easier to install. The Philips kit does provide more protection because of 2 separate relays and fuses. The power is taken from the battery so your car factory wires are completely 100% safe. It\'s details like that that makes Philips based kits the best....Xtec is still very very good but it\'s not Philips.

You can actually buy our connectors and Philips rebased bulbs and you\'d be able to run them from your Xtec ballast btw.;)

Let\'s bring this thread back from the dead.

In the quote above, M3-GT/Xenon Expert says that the \"The Philips kit does provide more protection because of 2 separate relays and fuses. The power is taken from the battery so your car factory wires are completely 100% safe.\" yet, in this thread on M3F (http://www.mazda3forums.com/viewtopic.php?t=13639), when referencing this pic of the \"No-DRL Relay Mod\" in this thread on TM3 (http://torontomazda3.com/forum/read.php?TID=1341):

http://www.geocities.com/vchung007/XTecInstallationWiringDiagram.jpg
Image courtesy of chaser

he says:


Originally posted by M3-GT/Xenon Expert
This is not a safe way to do it. Plus if you want to retro back to halogen if you sell your car or give it back after a lease you have messed with the factory wires. But it works....I wouldn\'t do that but it works.

yes, i\'ve taken that out of context and the whole discussion in the thread on M3F gets into a long exchange between M3-GT/Xenon Expert and myself; with M3-GT/Xenon Expert providing no valid reason as to why he wouldn\'t do the \"No-DRL Relay Mod\". Where is this going? Well, after looking at this pic for the first time since October 2004:

http://www.xenonexpert.com/guides/image_hid_kit1.jpg

it dawned on me that the \"No-DRL Relay Mod\" is even SIMPLER on the Polarion HID Kit (sold by M3-GT/Xenon Expert). All you have to do with the Polarion HID Kit is tap into the parking light wire and put it on one of the wires going to the \"factory headlight plug\". In this pic below, rather than having both wires go into the stock headlight plug, connect one of the wires into the tapped parking light wire. That\'s IT!

http://www.xenonexpert.com/guides/image_hid9.jpg

The wires in the Polarion Kit going \"to factory headlight plug\" is the Switched Input on the relay (which is why \"polarity doesn\'t matter\"). The other wires are the fused +12V input, the Ground and the +12V output.

What does this mean? Well, aside from the \"No-DRL Relay Mod\" being a safer way to wire the XTEC HID Kit, it pretty much wires the XTEC Kit like the Polarion HID Kit.

So M3-GT/Xenon Expert/Oliver, is having a relay safe or unsafe? Looks like he pretty much contradicted himself. (yes, in that thread he did retract his \"unsafe\" remark, but his initial comment was made without basis).

So, for those who choose to purchase the Polarion HID kit, if you don\'t want to use your HIDs as DRLs, just tap the parking light wire and connect it to one of the wires shown above. To keep some other form of DRLs, you can do the independent fog mod available here (http://www.mazda3forums.com/viewtopic.php?t=11730), or will M3-GT/Xenon Expert/Oliver take that down and start charging for that information too? :sarc If that\'s the case, you can get it done at Lockdown Enterprises for cheaper than the $25USD being charged by M3-GT/Xenon Expert/Oliver for his DRL bypass guide.


You might be asking yourself \"why the long post about this and what\'s your beef with M3-GT/Xenon Expert/Oliver?\" Well, anyone that charges for a \"how-to\" (it\'s just a guide, he isn\'t installing this..but, yes, it is included \"free\" when you buy a kit from him) when it should really be freely available information, is not a car enthusiast trying to help out the community, he\'s a business man first and foremost looking to make a quick buck (you think this guy (http://www.msprotege.com/vbb225/showthread.php?s=&threadid=26232) charged for the amount of time and effort put in? Doesn\'t look like it.). Not only that, BUT when someone else (myself in this case (http://www.mazda3forums.com/viewtopic.php?t=13639)) tries to help out the 3 community and they are discredited by said business man, then that just isn\'t right.

In conclusion, if you want a Polarion HID Kit, buy one from Xenon Factory (http://www.xenonfactory.com/products/hid/polarion.htm); if you want a XTEC kit, buy one from Devin/The Xenon Store (http://www.thexenonstore.com/). Why support someone who pulls his once free guide and then begins charging for it when he doesn\'t want to answer anymore questions because people didn\'t buy a HID kit from him. :sarc

[umnitza]

If you want an Xtec kit, we sell them for $260 shipped to US and $275 shipped to CAN.

[MazdaTree]

Originally posted by umnitza


If you want an Xtec kit, we sell them for $260 shipped to US and $275 shipped to CAN.

can you declair it as lower price so we dont get raped by customs here in canada?

[umnitza]

Originally posted by MazdaTree



Originally posted by umnitza


If you want an Xtec kit, we sell them for $260 shipped to US and $275 shipped to CAN.

can you declair it as lower price so we dont get raped by customs here in canada?

we can declare as commercial sample.

[MazdaTree]

Originally posted by umnitza



Originally posted by MazdaTree



Originally posted by umnitza


If you want an Xtec kit, we sell them for $260 shipped to US and $275 shipped to CAN.

can you declair it as lower price so we dont get raped by customs here in canada?

we can declare as commercial sample.

what does that mean?

[majic]

Originally posted by MazdaTree



Originally posted by umnitza



Originally posted by MazdaTree



Originally posted by umnitza


If you want an Xtec kit, we sell them for $260 shipped to US and $275 shipped to CAN.

can you declair it as lower price so we dont get raped by customs here in canada?

we can declare as commercial sample.

what does that mean?

it means that it\'s a sample, thus it\'s most likely free.. thus even 200% duties on 0 still equals $0 :)

btw.. i just got my Xtec kit from umnitza, yay :) (mine was shipped to US so no duties forme as my dad brought it over) now i need to get it installed and figure out a DRL method i like.. can\'t wait!! thanks umnitza!

[umnitza]

Thanks.

[mEtH]

How do we go abouts purchasing through you? Can\'t find it anywhere on the site.

Do you happen to have the 4500k available? I know you have close ties with Devin and he said he is unable to provide that temp nowadays.

Thanks